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For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Have a textbook or grammar book that you find particularly helpful? What about a learning tip to share with others?

RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby Tesu » Mon 12.31.2007 12:16 am

My first thought when I read this was "How can someone who has only been studying for a month give tips on studying correctly?"

But actually found your post very well written, and probably actually quite accurate. Good form ;)
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby sugoiaisukurimu » Mon 12.31.2007 2:35 pm

prep_girl_Nessa wrote:
sugoiaisukurimu wrote:
Kisshu: No, you can't learn just from manga, but it's a good place to start, especially with the pronunciation of Kanji and where you find it. It's a good idea to get a magazine or newspaper, and as you begin to understand more, more difficult books. Believe me, you'll pick up on the grammar if you read enough of it.

Mike: That's completely off topic and insulting.


Actually, I think manga is horrid starting place. I'm not much into manga, but I think the speaking patterns are similar to Japanese television dramas - usually very informal and sometimes even rude.

For me, I've been studying about 2 years, and I know the difference between formal and informal speaking. After watching a few episodes of something like 'hana yori dango' I always start talking like Matsu-Jun's character, even though I fully know it's not appropriate. (I've even made the mistake around native speakers, who luckily just laughed it off after I explained what happened.)

Basically, even when you know it's wrong, if you're used to hearing/listening/using informal speaking patterns it's hard to stop using them and go for the formal/not rude patterns. At the beginning stages when you don't understand the difference it's nearly impossible.

And I think if you re-read what Mike said, you'll find it's not insulting to you at all. Actually it's more of a complement.

That's a good point about manga being informal. I don't know whether it is or not, myself, or if it depends on what manga you read, but I agree it's a must to take out the sentences you find from there and understand the complete meaning and its formality.

As for Mike, he wasn't talking about me, but regardless, that wasn't a compliment to my country, and it is not accurate at all. But like I said, it's off topic, and I'm not going to argue over the American education system here.

to thread: Personally, what has been working for me as a beginner, regardless of how long I've been studying, has been learning the characters and phrases through reading and listening to native speakers. You can disagree if you like, and if you do, back it up like prep_girl.
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby Musiflare » Mon 12.31.2007 4:09 pm

sugoiaisukurimu wrote:
As for Mike, he wasn't talking about me, but regardless, that wasn't a compliment to my country, and it is not accurate at all. But like I said, it's off topic, and I'm not going to argue over the American education system here.


It's not an attack at the American education system, but more at the fact that American youth are too lazy to capitalize and punctuate appropriately--and that's perfectly accurate. I like to think it can all be summed up in a single quote from bash.org:

"Kraigen: Since the creation of the Internet, the Earth's rotation has been fueled, primarily, by the collective spinning of English teachers in their graves."
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby Hatori » Mon 12.31.2007 4:57 pm

Mike Cash wrote:
sugoiaisukurimu wrote:

Mike: That's completely off topic and insulting.


I notice you don't contest its accuracy.....

And since I don't believe people have any right being offended at accurate statements, I reject the notion that it is insulting.

Mike, you're the reason why I write better online. See, Mike's the grammatic savior. :p
---
Anyway, I remember when I joined this website when I was ten or eleven... I had this great enthusiasm; but now that I'm in high school, I feel like things are so impossible...
Over the years I've learned more about the culture of Japan and many words from here and there, but I have a very short attention span when it comes to things I have to keep up with other than homework. :|
I give a deep sigh and only think I'll be able to keep up my German learning... :(
我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。
lol
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby SerpentPanda » Mon 12.31.2007 5:09 pm

Wow, there were so many comments, and I didn't even notice.

When I said beginners, I meant people who were really just starting off learning Japanese. I actually wrote this for a friend in our class. He loves everything about Japan but is too lazy to learn the language. Hopefully this serves as motivation for him.

What textbooks should I get? My sister was thinking of getting the Genki Textbook and Workbook for me. I'm pretty sure those are pretty good, but I can only go by other people's words.

And if it is good, should I get I or II? I'm pretty sure I would get I, but I don't want a textbook filled with stuff I can already do, lulz.

[I know 110 kanji, can read hiragana well, and am too lazy to learn katakana, lol. My grammar is...ok, my listening skills for what I do know is good, but I have a very limited vocabulary. I might know around...200-ish words.]

In a nutshell, I couldn't pass JLPT 4.

Thanks for the compliments.
Last edited by SerpentPanda on Mon 12.31.2007 5:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby Hatori » Mon 12.31.2007 5:27 pm

I have some good books you may be interested in purchasing when you get the cash:
Japanese in 10 Minutes a Day (published by Bilingual Books Inc.)
Japanese Phrasebook (published by Lonely Planet)
Japanese Grammar by Nobuo and Carol Akiyama (published by Barron's Educational Series Inc.)
Essential Kanji by P.G.O'Neill (This is a REALLY AWESOME kanji book!!)
I also reccomend buying a dictionary too. :) It helps much.
我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。
lol
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby everdream » Mon 12.31.2007 7:19 pm

Hatori wrote:
Japanese in 10 Minutes a Day (published by Bilingual Books Inc.)

I have that book, and personally I don't like it.
It is a great book if you only plan a holiday to Japan, but not very good if you plan on learning the language.
I also don't like it's use of
"Koko ni some samples sentances for the denwa ga arimasu. Write them down in the blanks shita." for example.

(also, it is all in romaji, so I don't think it's right for the OP)
Last edited by everdream on Mon 12.31.2007 7:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby Mike Cash » Mon 12.31.2007 7:55 pm

sugoiaisukurimu wrote:


As for Mike, he wasn't talking about me, but regardless, that wasn't a compliment to my country, and it is not accurate at all.


Our country, sweetheart.

And it is accurate. That horrid run-on sentence of yours is proof enough.

The generation of American teachers who came along and supplanted the bunch who taught my generation of students decided that spelling and grammar didn't matter anymore. Even worse, they played into the modern pc touchy-feely nonsense to the point that today's youth react to any statement not containing some Oprahish verbal hug as though it were direct physical intimidation.
Never underestimate my capacity for pettiness.
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby SerpentPanda » Mon 12.31.2007 8:25 pm

everdream wrote:
Hatori wrote:
Japanese in 10 Minutes a Day (published by Bilingual Books Inc.)

I have that book, and personally I don't like it.
It is a great book if you only plan a holiday to Japan, but not very good if you plan on learning the language.
I also don't like it's use of
"Koko ni some samples sentances for the denwa ga arimasu. Write them down in the blanks shita." for example.

(also, it is all in romaji, so I don't think it's right for the OP)


I need something with kana and kanji in it. One of my friends is getting the Genki textbook; he'll tell me if he likes it or not.

As for Japan, I might visit around my high school graduation, and I plan on being nearly fluent in the language. After all, that's going to be in about 6 years from now.
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby everdream » Mon 12.31.2007 8:31 pm

I have genki II (At least in PDF), it is really good, IMO.
Though, it is structered more for classes, it is good on it's own too.
We grow too soon old and too late smart. - Steve Wright

'Know thyself?' If I knew myself, I'd run away. - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

I went on a diet, swore off drinking and heavy eating, and in fourteen days I had lost exactly two weeks.
- Joe E. Lewis
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby SerpentPanda » Mon 12.31.2007 8:38 pm

Ahh. I suppose I'll get the Genki I workbook and textbook, seeing as how I'm learning for passing JLPT 4.

Should I get the answer key also?
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby everdream » Mon 12.31.2007 8:40 pm

Yes!
Otherwise, how can you be you you've grasped the points correctly?
I wasn't going to get it myself, but after doing one exercise in the book, I was thinking 'is that right, or is that not?'
We grow too soon old and too late smart. - Steve Wright

'Know thyself?' If I knew myself, I'd run away. - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

I went on a diet, swore off drinking and heavy eating, and in fourteen days I had lost exactly two weeks.
- Joe E. Lewis
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby SerpentPanda » Mon 12.31.2007 8:46 pm

Oh, ok then.

Somewhat off topic: My sister is going to have to spend over $70 on everything then. She promised she'd get me the workbooks, but...
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RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby everdream » Mon 12.31.2007 8:48 pm

have you checked out the shop on this site?
altogether, it would cost about $50 here.
We grow too soon old and too late smart. - Steve Wright

'Know thyself?' If I knew myself, I'd run away. - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

I went on a diet, swore off drinking and heavy eating, and in fourteen days I had lost exactly two weeks.
- Joe E. Lewis
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Posts: 149
Joined: Sun 11.11.2007 3:32 pm

RE: For beginners-Some little tips for studying Japanese

Postby SerpentPanda » Mon 12.31.2007 9:00 pm

I checked amazon and saw it was around 70. I thought the answer guide was a seperate book, o_o.
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