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Online learning/memorising tools?

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Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby Benvolio » Wed 10.29.2008 2:44 pm

Hey guys. I've started learning Kanji at University and I have also begun to learn lots various Verbs & Nouns,
As such I need to look into learning/memorising methods.

The two that have been suggested the most are:

Anki - http://www.ichi2.net/anki/
JMemorise = http://jmemorize.org/weblog/2006/10/16/jmemorizeorg/

Can you tell me anything about them or suggest one? Or suggest another one?

Also as I'm running basic Vista I cannot type in Japanese, so does anyone know of any good source of Japanese Learning Online Flash cards? I understand that it is best to make them yourself.

Thank you.

I have also just came across another online programme for learning Japanese http://www.iknow.co.jp/ I will check it out.
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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby richvh » Wed 10.29.2008 3:05 pm

The notion that you can't type in Japanese in Vista Basic is a misconception. What Vista Basic won't allow you to do is to install a foreign language user interface (i.e., having all menus etc. in Japanese.) You can install a foreign language input method just as you could with XP (and following pretty much the same steps, as far as I know.)
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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby Benvolio » Wed 10.29.2008 3:15 pm

Thanks for that. I was under the impression that only Vista Ultimate lets you type in Japanese. I have read that from various sources. However I am still lost as to where I can attain a foreign language input method for Japanese for
64 bit Vista Home Premium. I have searched before and came up blank. Thanks.
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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby furrykef » Wed 10.29.2008 3:29 pm

I think Anki's the best flash card program there is right now. It's a lot more advanced than jMemorize is and it scales up a lot better (meaning you won't get overwhelmed if you add thousands of flash cards -- as long as you pace yourself).

As for typing Japanese, Windows comes with the Japanese IME, though you might need your CD to be able to install it. Try this page.

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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby Benvolio » Wed 10.29.2008 3:42 pm

ありがと。

Thank you so very much! This is going to help a lot!
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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby furrykef » Wed 10.29.2008 3:54 pm

Don't forget that the "o" is long: ありがとう。 ;)
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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby Denus » Wed 10.29.2008 4:03 pm

Random question: when using Anki, do you only concentrate on recognizing kanji and the meaning of the word only? Or do you also test how to write the kanji?
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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby Benvolio » Wed 10.29.2008 6:52 pm

Denus wrote:Random question: when using Anki, do you only concentrate on recognizing kanji and the meaning of the word only? Or do you also test how to write the kanji?


From what I gather Anki is really just for memorising, so you can learn to recognise the Kanji & the meaning. In terms of learning to write, from what a lot of people suggest it's best to write them yourself on paper as you go through the flash cards, and say the words to yourself also as you go along. (covering, reading, writing, speaking) :D

If you make the Anki flash cards yourself you can input as much as you want to learn.
The Kanji the Hiragana the Meaning it's all up to you.
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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby furrykef » Wed 10.29.2008 11:26 pm

Yep: you test whatever the hell you want. I haven't figured out a format that will satisfy me for learning Japanese, so I don't have any Japanese items in Anki right now. (I would fix that, except Spanish has me too occupied at the moment.) I have 803 facts and 1249 cards for Spanish, though (a 'fact' can have either one or two cards -- sometimes more than two depending on the model you use).

In the majority of cases, I write a sentence -- so far I've managed to use only complete sentences (I try to avoid trivial sentences like "It's red" to learn the word "red", but I very occasionally settle on them when a better sentence is hard to find) -- and I usually test only production, because it's much more helpful than testing recognition. You tend to learn recognition automatically with production, but the converse isn't true. If the word or construction doesn't look like it'd be easy to recognize, I create a recognition item for it too. Sometimes -- rarely, at the moment -- I create a recognition-only item when I encounter a word or construction I don't plan to use myself -- perhaps if it uses a word that isn't in the dialect I'm studying.

I actually use a custom model that gives me a lot of fields per fact:

* Spanish sentence
* es->en question notes
* en->es answer notes
* English sentence
* en->es question notes
* es->en answer notes
* Sentence source (usu. so I can verify the original sentence; sometimes the source also has additional information. If I modified the sentence, I note it here.)

The question notes usually say things like "Translate this using an idiom" and the answer notes usually provide acceptable synonyms, pitfalls, etc. These are kept in separate fields to keep the notes from showing up at irrelevant times (for instance listing synonyms for the Spanish words on the question side of a Spanish -> English card is obviously a bad idea!).

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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby Ben Nielson » Sun 11.02.2008 9:48 am

I use Anki extensively with Japanese, running three decks..

One deck is a huge deck consisting of tons of example sentences. I test recognition and reading ability with this deck. When I study new grammar or find a new vocabulary word, I like to drop like 5 sentences consisting of the new material into this deck.

The second deck is my Kanji deck which I still review from Remembering the Kanji. I just try to keep this up to date and really nail down those stragglers/seldom used Kanji that cause me problems. This deck was precreated, with all of the Heisig keywords plus example vocabulary with each Kanji (which I generally pick through to find new vocab) as well as on and kun readings for each kanji.

The third deck is just vocabulary, which I use to test production of Kanji and writing practice. It kicks out a word in hiragana (and a little English if the word is a homophone), which I then have to supply the Kanji for.

Usually, a word first pops up in my deck of example sentences. Then after I can pretty much recognize it there, I toss it into the production deck.

Eventually, I'll abandon the Heisig deck and start another one where I'll test on/kun readings I guess.
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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby furrykef » Mon 11.03.2008 1:55 am

I don't understand why people create multiple decks. What's wrong with using one deck with multiple models? It's more convenient in just about every way.
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Re: Online learning/memorising tools?

Postby Ben Nielson » Mon 11.03.2008 6:09 am

My desktop crashed a while back and I had a very small, not so powerful laptop that was having trouble handling decks with 5000 facts... :)

Aside from that, I just like to keep it seperate - sometimes I feel like I want to sit down and write Kanji. So, I open up my Kanji or Vocab study decks. Sometimes, I don't want to bother so I open up my example sentence deck.

十人十色  :)
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