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A few mid-level intermediate quesitons (mostly grammar)

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A few mid-level intermediate quesitons (mostly grammar)

Postby ryuubu » Sun 04.27.2008 10:20 am

For some odd reason I've decided to devote myself to studying to pass the Level 2 JLPT, which encompasses the kanji, grammar and vocab at an intermediate level.

I've been out of formal learning for about 6 months, and the only studying I really do now is in conversation at work (I work at a Japanese restaurant) and my DS Kanji training games.

So I decided to take a blind swing at it, and took on of the weekly placement tests on KanjiStep.

Well the Kani training seem to have paid off at least, I managed to score 90% and 80% respectively on the reading and writing portion, but it went downhill from there.

Anyway, some of the grammar in the test I hadn't encountered before, and others I had, but just accepted them and never questioned other uses, so please can you kind souls clarify some grammar points for me?

---

*Verb stem-切る - I see this around a lot. For the most part I can understand I guess, as in 入り切る, 食べ切る but others are a bit more ambiguous. For example 思い切る. It feels like it conveys a feeling of completeness? Can anyone explain it clearly for little old me?

*I've also seen plain-past+きり in the sentence: 彼からは一ヶ月前にメールをもらったきり何の連絡もない. Is this a part of the same grammar?

*にかわって as in the sentence: 病気の母にかわって、姉が一緒に来てくれた. I would assume from looking at it it would mean something like in place of?

*あまり as in: 最近の若者はチャットに夢中な余り、食事も忘れてしまう. I'm not sure I've seen amari used like this before... can someone clarify?

*verb-てからでないと as in: 上司の確認を得てからでないとクライアントに返事はできない. I'm not sure how this one works. I can imagine the sentence is something like "If you don't get your superior's confirmation, you can't reply to the client..." How about another example using this grammar?

*verb-stem+つつも as in 仕事で忙しいと言いつつもデートはしっかりしている. I get a feeling the sentence means "Even though he says he's busy with work, he's still dating a lot."

Usually I can find examples using JBrute (a great program BTW), but these certain cases either turned up a million different random example sentences or none.

Any help would be muchly appreciated.

Also, any useful sites/books for one wanting to study for 2kyuu?
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Re: A few mid-level intermediate quesitons (mostly grammar)

Postby spin13 » Sun 04.27.2008 11:37 am

ryuubu wrote:*Verb stem-切る - I see this around a lot. For the most part I can understand I guess, as in 入り切る, 食べ切る but others are a bit more ambiguous. For example 思い切る. It feels like it conveys a feeling of completeness? Can anyone explain it clearly for little old me?


Correct. The meaning is usually something like 完全に~する. You can use various forms of the verb きる, particularly the potential.

思い切る is a funny one, though. It is defined with both 1 あきらめる。断念する。 and 2 決心する。覚悟する。 It's heavily context dependent.

*I've also seen plain-past+きり in the sentence: 彼からは一ヶ月前にメールをもらったきり何の連絡もない. Is this a part of the same grammar?


I would guess the origins are similar, but can't speak decisively on that. The meaning, however, is a little different. ~たまま is a similar meaning. The action happened and is now stuck in the resultant state.  "I received mail from him one month ago, but since then nothing (all communication has been cut)."

*にかわって as in the sentence: 病気の母にかわって、姉が一緒に来てくれた. I would assume from looking at it it would mean something like in place of?


Correct. It is the verb 代わる. You will also see にかわり.

*あまり as in: 最近の若者はチャットに夢中な余り、食事も忘れてしまう. I'm not sure I've seen amari used like this before... can someone clarify?


This one's in the dictionary.

*verb-てからでないと as in: 上司の確認を得てからでないとクライアントに返事はできない. I'm not sure how this one works. I can imagine the sentence is something like "If you don't get your superior's confirmation, you can't reply to the client..." How about another example using this grammar?


AてからでないとB / AてからでなければB
If not after A, B. Usually followed with words of non-feasibility (できない, 難しい, 無理).

*verb-stem+つつも as in 仕事で忙しいと言いつつもデートはしっかりしている. I get a feeling the sentence means "Even though he says he's busy with work, he's still dating a lot."


It's a stiff way of saying ~ながら or ~ているのに. The former meaning is usually just つつ while the latter takes both つつand つつも. It's often used with words that take the quoting particle と and isn't exactly flattering.

Also, any useful sites/books for one wanting to study for 2kyuu?


Any 2kyuu book from any of the major companies would have answered all of your questions. They will, however, do so only in Japanese. This is a Good Thing.

I would recommend どんなときどう使う as I believe it covers both 1kyuu and 2kyuu and does a decent job of contrasting similar points. The Unicom book has the answers but was organized by monkeys. I never tried the Kanzen Master series for 2kyuu.

-Eric
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Re: A few mid-level intermediate quesitons (mostly grammar)

Postby yukamina » Mon 04.28.2008 2:40 am

I've been using this site for JLPT2 grammar http://www.tanos.co.uk/jlpt/jlpt2/grammar/
They have Level 1 too.
(And now I'm accumulating a list of books I want that I can't really find : P )
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Re: A few mid-level intermediate quesitons (mostly grammar)

Postby NocturnalOcean » Mon 04.28.2008 2:50 am

spin13 wrote:
ryuubu wrote:

*あまり as in: 最近の若者はチャットに夢中な余り、食事も忘れてしまう. I'm not sure I've seen amari used like this before... can someone clarify?


This one's in the dictionary.


I am not sure this usage is listed in the dictionary though.
A rephrasing of this pattern, could be something like ---すぎるから, -----

It can be attached to adjectives, and even verbs. But I think the most typical is adjectives that expresses some kind of feeling.

You often see such as 悲しさのあまり、うれしさのあまり and so on.
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Re: A few mid-level intermediate quesitons (mostly grammar)

Postby Oracle » Mon 04.28.2008 8:19 am

~のあまりに can be used with nouns as well.
I was living way out in the country in Yamaguchi-ken for a while and when a friend from Tokyo came to visit her comment was:
田舎のあまりにびっくりした :D
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Re: A few mid-level intermediate quesitons (mostly grammar)

Postby spin13 » Mon 04.28.2008 10:46 am

NocturnalOcean wrote:I am not sure this usage is listed in the dictionary though.


余り @ 大辞泉 Via Yahoo!

In English, EDICT gives:
[3] surplus; excess; fullness; too much
[4] (n-suf) overjoyed; overwhelmed

I certainly agree with your definition though and would point out that 余り is a noun (among other things) which of course means it can be modified by verbs, adjectives, and other nouns + の.
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