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Help with counters!!!

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Help with counters!!!

Postby Svensk » Fri 06.26.2009 2:33 pm

Hello!
I have very deep problems with counters, and I hope that you girls and boys can help me a little bit.

1. 二月 means "february" and "two months", but can it also mean "two moons"? Which counter do you use when you count moons? How do you say "I saw two moons" or, "I bought two moons" (silly question, I know, but let us focus on the grammar)?
2. According to jisho.org, 二月, when it means "two months", is pronounced ふたつき, but I have heard that "two months" in japanese is "nikagetsu". What is the difference between "futatsuki" and "nikagetsu"? Is "tsuki" a counter?

I will maybe return with a few more questions later, I am sure there is something I have missed.

Thank you so much for your time!
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby two_heads_talking » Fri 06.26.2009 2:43 pm

moons are generally round, so you'd use the counting device for spheres.. But I will be honest, I have completely forgotten what the counting device for spheres is.

I think futatsuki = two months and nigatsu= February.. not sure about nikagetsu though..
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby Yudan Taiteki » Fri 06.26.2009 2:47 pm

Svensk wrote:Hello!
I have very deep problems with counters, and I hope that you girls and boys can help me a little bit.

1. 二月 means "february" and "two months", but can it also mean "two moons"?


No. 月 means only what orbits the Earth; "moons" of other planets are 衛星 and are counted with 個. (The Japanese wikipedia article even has a note on the English usage: 英語では、口語的に "moons" という言葉で、月にかぎらず、各惑星等の衛星全般を指すこともある。)

2. According to jisho.org, 二月, when it means "two months", is pronounced ふたつき, but I have heard that "two months" in japanese is "nikagetsu". What is the difference between "futatsuki" and "nikagetsu"? Is "tsuki" a counter?


ふたつき is archaic.
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby two_heads_talking » Fri 06.26.2009 3:22 pm

Yudan Taiteki wrote:
ふたつき is archaic.


Interestingly enough, when I looked things up on Jim Breens wwwjdic, futatsuki is listed as 2 months and nikagetsu is not listed at all..

I've been using archaic terminology and didn't realize I was.. Doh?!!
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby Yudan Taiteki » Fri 06.26.2009 3:42 pm

I could be wrong; maybe it's not as archaic as I think.
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby two_heads_talking » Fri 06.26.2009 3:54 pm

Yudan Taiteki wrote:I could be wrong; maybe it's not as archaic as I think.



Your information is usually pretty good.. :mrgreen:
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby astaroth » Fri 06.26.2009 4:19 pm

two_heads_talking wrote:Interestingly enough, when I looked things up on Jim Breens wwwjdic, futatsuki is listed as 2 months and nikagetsu is not listed at all..

I looked it up too and what is listed in wwwjdic is ヶ月 (by itself) as: (ctr) number of months.
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby Svensk » Sat 06.27.2009 3:47 am

Ok! But even though "ふたつき" might be very old, I can still use it the same way as I use "かげつ", right?

One more thing; If ひとつき (一月) means one month, should'nt there be a counter after is?
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby astaroth » Sat 06.27.2009 8:03 am

Svensk wrote:One more thing; If ひとつき (一月) means one month, should'nt there be a counter after is?

月 is the counter.
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby Svensk » Sun 06.28.2009 11:41 am

astaroth wrote:
Svensk wrote:One more thing; If ひとつき (一月) means one month, should'nt there be a counter after is?

月 is the counter.


Ok!:) Thanks!
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby two_heads_talking » Mon 06.29.2009 9:04 am

Svensk wrote:Ok! But even though "ふたつき" might be very old, I can still use it the same way as I use "かげつ", right?


That's what Chris (Yudan) and I were discussing. I haven't been to Japan in about a decade, while Chris has been there more recently (and might still be there now?) so, his insight will be more current or modern in my opinion.

Use it and see if there seems to be a confusion, if so, then use kagetsu..
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Re: Help with counters!!!

Postby NocturnalOcean » Mon 06.29.2009 9:24 am

According to my Japanese girlfriend, you can use both ひとつき、ふたつき and いっかげつ、にかげつ.
But using 一ヶ月、二ヶ月 is a bit more common. ひとつき has a more stiff, formal ring to it.
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