View topic - 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
雨が降ってきたので・・・・
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雨が降ってきたので・・・・
I'm a little unclear on the meaning of "きた" in this sentence:
雨が降ってきたので傘を差しました。
This sentence (which I got from smart.fm) was translated as, "I opened my umbrella as it started to rain."
Does the きた mean "started to"? Maybe it's like, "It came to rain, so I opened my umbrella"?
- Kef
雨が降ってきたので傘を差しました。
This sentence (which I got from smart.fm) was translated as, "I opened my umbrella as it started to rain."
Does the きた mean "started to"? Maybe it's like, "It came to rain, so I opened my umbrella"?
- Kef
Founder of Learning Languages Through Video Games.
Also see my lang-8 journal, where you can help me practice Japanese (and Spanish, and Italian!)
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furrykef - Posts: 1556
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
It indicates the direction of the action, that is to say that the rain is coming towards the speaker.
Perhaps, "The rain came down, so I opened my umbrella." or something similar if you want a slightly more literal translation.
Perhaps, "The rain came down, so I opened my umbrella." or something similar if you want a slightly more literal translation.
そうだ、嬉しいんだ、生きる喜び!
例え胸の傷が痛んでも。
例え胸の傷が痛んでも。
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becki_kanou - Posts: 3400
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
Ahhh. Thanks 
Last edited by furrykef on Fri 08.21.2009 12:05 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Also see my lang-8 journal, where you can help me practice Japanese (and Spanish, and Italian!)
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furrykef - Posts: 1556
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
Is the きた required, then? Would leaving it out imply that it's raining somewhere other than where the speaker is, for instance?
Founder of Learning Languages Through Video Games.
Also see my lang-8 journal, where you can help me practice Japanese (and Spanish, and Italian!)
Also see my lang-8 journal, where you can help me practice Japanese (and Spanish, and Italian!)
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furrykef - Posts: 1556
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
furrykef wrote:Is the きた required, then? Would leaving it out imply that it's raining somewhere other than where the speaker is, for instance?
Hmmm.... I want to revise my first answer. The きた gives it a sense of immediacy; that it just began to rain, whereas if you just had 降った it could be talking about a time in the past.
そうだ、嬉しいんだ、生きる喜び!
例え胸の傷が痛んでも。
例え胸の傷が痛んでも。
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becki_kanou - Posts: 3400
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
Hmm... so it's like 降っていた, but with a sense of direction, perhaps? Or is it more like "the rain came down", but "came down" is seen as an event rather than a general condition?
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Also see my lang-8 journal, where you can help me practice Japanese (and Spanish, and Italian!)
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furrykef - Posts: 1556
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
furrykef wrote:Hmm... so it's like 降っていた, but with a sense of direction, perhaps?
Not really. 降っていた indicates a sense of duration, while 降って来た indicates the beginning of the action/event + direction. There are a lot of situations where you can use V+来る or V+行く to indicate that the action is coming towards or going away from the speaker.
i.e. (彼は)こっちへ走ってきている vs. (彼は)あっちへ走っていっている.
OR 近づいてくる vs. 遠ざかっていく
そうだ、嬉しいんだ、生きる喜び!
例え胸の傷が痛んでも。
例え胸の傷が痛んでも。
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becki_kanou - Posts: 3400
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
OK, so, it emphasizes direction and the start of the event? If, hypothetically, rain fell up instead of down, you would say 降って行った (never mind that "falling up" doesn't make sense, I'm just trying to get a sense of the grammar here ^^;)?
EDIT: Or maybe if you were above the clouds, in an airplane, perhaps, so that down would be away from you?
EDIT: Or maybe if you were above the clouds, in an airplane, perhaps, so that down would be away from you?
Founder of Learning Languages Through Video Games.
Also see my lang-8 journal, where you can help me practice Japanese (and Spanish, and Italian!)
Also see my lang-8 journal, where you can help me practice Japanese (and Spanish, and Italian!)
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furrykef - Posts: 1556
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
That sounds about right. 降っていった just sounds weird because of the physics of the thing, but with other verbs it works just fine.
そうだ、嬉しいんだ、生きる喜び!
例え胸の傷が痛んでも。
例え胸の傷が痛んでも。
-

becki_kanou - Posts: 3400
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
Hmm, OK. Thanks! 
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Also see my lang-8 journal, where you can help me practice Japanese (and Spanish, and Italian!)
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furrykef - Posts: 1556
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
kuru is usually used with て to indicate either a beginning of a process, or continuation of an action up to a current point of time.
Examples from DBJG:
私はコンピューターが少しわかってきた
Now I have begun to understand computers
私はいろいろ日本の歴史を読んできた
Up to now I've been reading various Japanese histories
Also, kuru of this usage can be paraphrased using Vmasu hajimeru.
But kuru implies that something happens to the speaker or whomever the speaker can empathize with, and Vmasu hajimeru lacks the speaker's involvement.
Examples from DBJG:
私はコンピューターが少しわかってきた
Now I have begun to understand computers
私はいろいろ日本の歴史を読んできた
Up to now I've been reading various Japanese histories
Also, kuru of this usage can be paraphrased using Vmasu hajimeru.
But kuru implies that something happens to the speaker or whomever the speaker can empathize with, and Vmasu hajimeru lacks the speaker's involvement.
失敗は成功の元
- NocturnalOcean
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
So then it doesn't have to do with the direction of the rainfall? 
Founder of Learning Languages Through Video Games.
Also see my lang-8 journal, where you can help me practice Japanese (and Spanish, and Italian!)
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furrykef - Posts: 1556
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
Kuru can be used with directions too, but I do believe in your case it doesn't really have to do with direction, but with the beginning of the rain, and that it is somewhat related to the speaker.(he is close by and affected by it)
失敗は成功の元
- NocturnalOcean
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
furrykef wrote:So then it doesn't have to do with the direction of the rainfall?
No. In some cases きた indicates literal direction towards the speaker, but not here.
-Chris Kern
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Yudan Taiteki - Posts: 5609
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Re: 雨が降ってきたので・・・・
The more I think about it, Yudan is correct; I was wrong in my first assessment. Sorry. 
そうだ、嬉しいんだ、生きる喜び!
例え胸の傷が痛んでも。
例え胸の傷が痛んでも。
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becki_kanou - Posts: 3400
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