Learn Japanese with JapanesePod101.com

View topic - What to do?

What to do?

Do you have a translation question?

What to do?

Postby Gan » Sun 01.22.2006 5:01 pm

私は日本語が好きだでも朋輩の私が韓国人と好きためで朝鮮語
O.k. this is two questions in one, so i didnt really know where to post it at. sorry if its in the wrong thread please move it.

1. practicing some japanese.

Watashi ha nihongo ga suki demo tomoyakara no watashi ga kankokujin to suki tame de chousengo...

I wanted to say..

"I like Japanese but my friend is korean and wants me to learn the korean language."

Im having trouble with the last part... highlighted in red. please help.

and as far as the question goes should i learn korean too?
I want to speak in the same language as my friend but i also want to learn japanese please help.

BTW how horrible is my japanese??
User avatar
Gan
 
Posts: 341
Joined: Sat 06.04.2005 9:26 pm
Native language: English

RE: What to do?

Postby richvh » Sun 01.22.2006 6:11 pm

Well, first of all, 朋輩 is read houbai, not tomoyakara, and it should be 私の朋輩 not 朋輩の私. I think 友達 (tomodachi) is more common than 朋輩. You also need to put a copula after the "my friend is korean" phrase, and can't use "と" to connect it to the following "wants me to learn Korean" phrase, since "と" can only connect nouns or noun phrases. This is my version:

私は日本語が好きでも友達が韓国人で、彼は私が朝鮮語を習うことが欲しいです。

Watashi wa nihongo ga suki demo tomodachi ga kankokujin de, kare wa watashi ga chousengo wo narau koto ga hoshii desu.

As for whether you should korean or not, that's up to you.
Richard VanHouten
ゆきの物語
richvh
 
Posts: 6451
Joined: Thu 09.29.2005 10:35 pm

RE: What to do?

Postby Edvent » Sun 01.22.2006 6:22 pm

Watashi wa nihongo ga suki demo tomodachi ga kankokujin de, kare wa watashi ga chousengo wo narau koto ga hoshii desu.


could you explain the meaning of "de" after "kankokujin" to me?
If it is the plain form of "desu", why isn't "da"?
Edvent
 
Posts: 62
Joined: Wed 10.19.2005 3:33 pm

RE: What to do?

Postby Gan » Sun 01.22.2006 6:45 pm

well i dont understand.... if i wrote 悲しみの涙 wouldn't that mean tears of sadness??
so why isn't 友達の僕 my friend, instead of friend of me?

彼は私が朝鮮語を習うことが欲しいです。

I think that should be changed since my friend is a girl.

彼女は私が朝鮮語を習うことが欲しいです。she is a good friend so i really respect her... so that's why i think it sould be 彼女 instead of 彼.

also what would 韓国人 be ? i thought that a person was a noun...
User avatar
Gan
 
Posts: 341
Joined: Sat 06.04.2005 9:26 pm
Native language: English

RE: What to do?

Postby richvh » Sun 01.22.2006 7:04 pm

Edvent wrote:
Watashi wa nihongo ga suki demo tomodachi ga kankokujin de, kare wa watashi ga chousengo wo narau koto ga hoshii desu.


could you explain the meaning of "de" after "kankokujin" to me?
If it is the plain form of "desu", why isn't "da"?

"De", in this case, is the -te form of "desu".

theshadowtaker wrote:
well i dont understand.... if i wrote 悲しみの涙 wouldn't that mean tears of sadness??
so why isn't 友達の僕 my friend, instead of friend of me?


Because the possessor precedes the の particle; X の Y isn't X of Y, it's Y of X.

彼は私が朝鮮語を習うことが欲しいです。

I think that should be changed since my friend is a girl.

彼女は私が朝鮮語を習うことが欲しいです。she is a good friend so i really respect her... so that's why i think it sould be 彼女 instead of 彼.

also what would 韓国人 be ? i thought that a person was a noun...

Well, I couldn't tell sex from your original post. I've read that kanojo was coined in the Meiji era to make translating European novels easier, so kare probably isn't strictly speaking wrong even for a female.
Last edited by richvh on Sun 01.22.2006 7:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Richard VanHouten
ゆきの物語
richvh
 
Posts: 6451
Joined: Thu 09.29.2005 10:35 pm

RE: What to do?

Postby AJBryant » Sun 01.22.2006 7:35 pm

if i wrote 悲しみの涙 wouldn't that mean tears of sadness??
so why isn't 友達の僕 my friend, instead of friend of me?


You are putting it backwards in your second case. 悲しみの涙 *is* tears of sadness. 悲しみ is sadness, の is the same as apostrophe-s, and 涙 is tears. "sadness's tears" = "Tears of sadness."

友達の僕 would be "friend's me."

I know people often have trouble early on with the の=of thing -- the thing is, the order in Japanese is different. That's why I usually tell beginners to think of the の as 's, and the order stays the same in English.

田中の家 = Tanaka's house = the house of Tanaka
先生の教科書 = the teacher's textbook = the textbook of the teacher
東京の公園 = Tokyo's parks = the parks of Tokyo

Tony
User avatar
AJBryant
Site Admin
 
Posts: 5313
Joined: Sun 10.09.2005 11:29 am
Location: Indiana
Native language: English
Gender: Male

RE: What to do?

Postby Gan » Sun 01.22.2006 7:39 pm

she said she was gonna teach me korean.... but.... im already learning japanese... i dont think i can handle two at a time.
User avatar
Gan
 
Posts: 341
Joined: Sat 06.04.2005 9:26 pm
Native language: English

RE: What to do?

Postby AJBryant » Sun 01.22.2006 7:50 pm

I've read that kanojo was coined in the Meiji era to make translating European novels easier, so kare probably isn't strictly speaking wrong even for a female.


Old texts will often sometimes have "onna" for "her" -- referring to a female character as "the woman." Likewise, men are often referred to "otoko." You have to remember that Japanese doesn't tend to use pronouns, however. Most of the time, they're just left out.

Kare, however, NEVER can refer to a woman.

I don't know about the claim to "kanojo" being a Meiji neologism -- I really don't have the time or patience right now to look for earlier examples -- but that SHOULDN'T have been an issue in translating unless someone was being really pedantic with the word-for-wording, which is a BAD way to translate. A proper translation fits into the idiom of the target language, and pronouns would be just as infrequent in a good Japanese translation of Victor Hugo as it would be in a native Japanese novel.

Oddly, the "he" and "she" pronoun hanzi in Chinese only recently split to distinguish the "he" from the "she" hanzi (and, annoyingly, both are pronounced the same -- the same, in fact, as the pronoun "it."). The Chinese pronoun "he" (ta) is the same kanji that the Japanese use for "other" (他). It has no corresponding "male pronoun" function in Japanese. The pronoun for "she" in Chinese is the same, only it replaces the nin-ben radical (亻) with 女. As a new hanzi, it doesn't exist in Japanese.

Tony
Edited for bloody smilies....
Last edited by AJBryant on Sun 01.22.2006 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
AJBryant
Site Admin
 
Posts: 5313
Joined: Sun 10.09.2005 11:29 am
Location: Indiana
Native language: English
Gender: Male

RE: What to do?

Postby richvh » Sun 01.22.2006 8:25 pm

AJBryant wrote:
I've read that kanojo was coined in the Meiji era to make translating European novels easier, so kare probably isn't strictly speaking wrong even for a female.


Old texts will often sometimes have "onna" for "her" -- referring to a female character as "the woman." Likewise, men are often referred to "otoko." You have to remember that Japanese doesn't tend to use pronouns, however. Most of the time, they're just left out.

Kare, however, NEVER can refer to a woman.

I stand corrected.

I just remembered that "hoshigaru" or "hoshii da sou desu" or "hoshii da to iimasu" should have been used instead of "hoshii desu". Other than that and the pronoun issue, how is my translation?
Richard VanHouten
ゆきの物語
richvh
 
Posts: 6451
Joined: Thu 09.29.2005 10:35 pm

RE: What to do?

Postby mechakucha » Mon 01.23.2006 1:51 pm

richvh-san, the sentence:
私は日本語が好きでも友達が韓国人で、彼は私が朝鮮語を習うことが欲しいです。
Even if I like Japanese, my friend is a Korean and as for he, the thing of me learning Korean, he wants.

"I like Japanese but my friend is korean and wants me to learn the korean language."
日本語が好きんですが、友達は韓国人で(私に)韓鮮語を習って欲しがっています。
「〜て欲しがる」の代わりに、「〜てもらいたがる」も使えます。
I used 「〜て欲しがる」 as it is used through the third person perspective. As in, the third person wants someone to do something for him/her.

間違ったら、許してくれね! :)
Last edited by mechakucha on Mon 01.23.2006 2:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
mechakucha
 
Posts: 58
Joined: Thu 09.01.2005 7:24 pm


Return to Translation Questions or Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests