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Arudou Debito

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RE: Arudou Debito

Postby Kuri » Mon 12.24.2007 5:32 pm

Wakannai wrote:
Even with good intentions, you really shouldn't judge by looks. Actions are of course another matter.


So you shouldn't treat a policeman like a policeman because he looks like a policeman? You shouldn't give that person behind the counter your money just because they look like they work there? Or if someone wearing white robes and a pointy white hat and a mask came up to you, you would want to be his best friend?

The image we present those around use reflects our own attitudes towards ourselves and the way we want others to treat us.


1) Why is the pope wearing a mask?

2) If foreigners decide to adopt a uniform and badge then go ahead and notice they're clothes. And make judgements based on what they chose to do (ie get a job as a police officer and wear the uniform).

Not all police officers wear their uniform on duty all the time btw, doesn't mean they aren't cops anymore.

But the last bit is really the main point, What image did debito in the little escapade choose to present that made him look like a non citizen? I suppose it was because he didn't die his hair and buy contacts?
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RE: Arudou Debito

Postby Wakannai » Mon 12.24.2007 6:05 pm

Not all police officers wear their uniform on duty all the time btw, doesn't mean they aren't cops anymore.


It means they don't want to be recognized as cops. See the whole thing I wrote about the way we dress reflects the way we want to be treated.
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RE: Arudou Debito

Postby Kuri » Mon 12.24.2007 6:17 pm

Wakannai wrote:
See the whole thing I wrote about the way we dress reflects the way we want to be treated.


That's your point? I must've missed something... How is that on topic? Has Debito started walking around with a flag on his lapel?
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RE: Arudou Debito

Postby Wakannai » Mon 12.24.2007 6:34 pm

That's kind of the point exactly, just because somebody looks like something doesn't mean you should treat them like that.


Did you forget writing this?

You argued that judging people by their looks was inherently wrong. I countered your argument. You did not limit your argument to Debito's specific delima.
Last edited by Wakannai on Mon 12.24.2007 6:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: Arudou Debito

Postby Kuri » Mon 12.24.2007 6:59 pm

Wakannai wrote:
That's kind of the point exactly, just because somebody looks like something doesn't mean you should treat them like that.


Did you forget writing this?

You argued that judging people by their looks was inherently wrong. I countered your argument. You did not limit your argument to Debito's specific delima.


Context, but I suppose I did mention a jacket didn't I.

So I'll take credit for de-railing the thread and apologize with the hopes that it'll find it's way back on topic and maybe somebody will have some more nice things to say about the subject (I don't really like saying negative things about people when they aren't around ^^; )
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RE: Arudou Debito

Postby Harisenbon » Mon 12.24.2007 8:00 pm

keatonatron wrote:
I was thinking about this exact same thing the other day. In America (any state), 95% of the Latin people you see will be American citizens. However, in Japan, 99.9% of white people you see will NOT be Japanese citizens. Therefore, it is horribly insulting to assume something based on race in America, but understandable in Japan. That doesn't mean that it feels demeaning and annoys even me, but you can't say it's an outrageous racial-profiling created to make foreigners feel like second-rate citizens.


On the flip-side, because America is made up of so many cultures, they fall into the "everyone is american" "everyone speaks english" way of thinking.

Many years ago before my wife could really speak english, the two of us when back to my hometown. She was looking at video games in a store while a clerk came up behind her and started talking to her. He got disgusted that she was obviously "ignoring" him, and started to walk off in a huff when I tried to explain that she was Japanese and didn't speak english, his reponse was "Yeah Right."

Until about 10 years ago it was incredibly rare to see a foreigner in Japan. I used to get stared at all the time. These days no one really stares. People's views towards foreginers are changing, but at the same time the number of foreigners who take Japanese citizenship are still incredibly small. I know when I walk down the street and see a foreigner, I don't immediately think "oh, I bet he got citizenship." It's not prejudice, it's just playing the odds.

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RE: Arudou Debito

Postby Hatori » Tue 12.25.2007 12:27 am

I know NOTHING of this guy, but remember this:

You can add more to an entry on Wikipedia. You look "sky" and it says it's blue. You add saying,"the sky is green on St. Patricks Day every 30 years."

He may look like an idiot, or an idiot added idiotic information about him. But don't worry, I still love Wiki. ;)
我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。我是老师。
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RE: Arudou Debito

Postby doinkies » Tue 12.25.2007 12:57 am

Harisenbon wrote:
Until about 10 years ago it was incredibly rare to see a foreigner in Japan. I used to get stared at all the time. These days no one really stares. People's views towards foreginers are changing, but at the same time the number of foreigners who take Japanese citizenship are still incredibly small. I know when I walk down the street and see a foreigner, I don't immediately think "oh, I bet he got citizenship." It's not prejudice, it's just playing the odds.


This part, particularly the part about how nobody really stares at you nowadays, reminds me of a post Mike Cash made. He posted to a thread made by a black person who was nervous about going to Japan and being stared at and whatnot with this:

Foreigners (white or black) don't draw 1% of the gawks and unwanted attention that we did back when I first came here. Put this particular concern out of your mind.


I've always kept that in mind when reading these sorts of threads.
Last edited by doinkies on Tue 12.25.2007 12:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: Arudou Debito

Postby Mike Cash » Tue 12.25.2007 8:54 am

I recall reading an article in the Japan Times way back when in which it was reported that from 1985 to 1988 the number of Western foreigners in Tokyo increased FIVE HUNDRED PERCENT. I always make it a point to avoid saying how long I've been here, but let's just say that I remember the days before the influx. The difference between then and now is like night and day. And with the further and more widespread influx of Brazilians and Peruvians starting a decade or so ago and the implementation of the JET program, the amount of gawks has pretty much dropped to zero. Ditto the incidence of little kids saying ハロー to our backs after we've passed by and gaggles of high school girls shouting and waving from across the street and then giggling uncontrollably as though they had just made a puppy do a new trick if you waved back at them.

This place has had changes and made advances that I never would have believed possible "back in the day".
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RE: Arudou Debito

Postby skrhgh3b » Tue 12.25.2007 8:16 pm

a lot of people are put off by a white american creating a civil rights ruckus in a foreign country, and that's not too difficult for this white american to understand, but if i had been in david's shoes, i probably would have made the same ruckus he did. i remember a conversation i had about the "japanese only" controversy with my then-japanese girlfriend the first time i visited japan. she didn't see anything wrong about an onsen denying its services to customers based on their "foreign" appearance, but when i pointed out that if we had two children together, and one of them took after myself and the other took after her, and an onsen turned away our child that looked like me and allowed our child that looked like her, would she still feel the same way about it, and to her credit, her opinion changed on a dime.
Last edited by skrhgh3b on Tue 12.25.2007 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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