Important points when writing in Japanese

[adonis0418]

I have got some other problems, when talking with Japanese guys, sometimes they use "は-" with descending tone instead of "はい". I am wondering whether this is accptable and polite in talking with acquaintances? Cos it sounds a little bit informal and impolite. and similarly, some people say ねい instead of ない. Is this simply a dialect? preferrence? or have some pragmatic indications? I know some gangsters and teenagers like to speak Japanese with their tongues retroflexed (like some words in Spainish and Italian) to show rudeness or strength, but what about the problem I have metioned here? Thanks very much.

[keatonatron]

I have got some other problems, when talking with Japanese guys, sometimes they use "は-" with descending tone instead of "はい".

This is informal. It's fine with friends, but with superiors or people you want (need) to be polite to, you should stick with a well-pronounced はい, or an ええ if you feel more lazy.

similarly, some people say ねい instead of ない. Is this simply a dialect?

No, it's slang, like "ain't" in English. Another thing that will get you slapped if you use it when talking to superiors.

[two_heads_talking]

similarly, some people say ねい instead of ない. Is this simply a dialect?

No, it's slang, like "ain't" in English. Another thing that will get you slapped if you use it when talking to superiors.

unless your boss/superior is a yakuza.. ermm.... yeah what Keatonatron said...

[furrykef]

I heard some of the male middle school students use it with their friends, but that's it.

On the other side of that coin, I read once of somebody who used that word -- I think it was that word -- jokingly with a friend, and his friend was confused: "What? I don't want to fight you!" Although friends often use insulting terms to each other, that sort of humor doesn't always translate across languages...

- Kef

[adonis0418]

unless your boss/superior is a yakuza.. ermm.... yeah what Keatonatron said...

I see, since it is used in Yakuza society, it would be quite rude...I dont wanna get slapped, haha.

[adonis0418]

No, it's slang, like "ain't" in English. Another thing that will get you slapped if you use it when talking to superiors.

If I had a Japanese boss, I would be extremely careful since they attached a great importance to the hierarchy system. Thank you for your reminding LOL

[keatonatron]

I read once of somebody who used that word -- I think it was that word -- jokingly with a friend, and his friend was confused: "What? I don't want to fight you!"

Yeah, that was me.

Wow, my posts are finally making it into the annals of history, being remembered simply as "I read once of somebody who..."

However that time, the word was てめえ (手前). I think my friend was simply asking me (in English) what new words I have learned, and in response I simply said the word. It was met with the exact answer you quoted above.

貴様 is much worse though.

[Sairana]

I see, since it is used in Yakuza society, it would be quite rude...

That's an interesting conclusion to draw. It's just plain rude, not -because- it's used by Yakuza. The tongue-in-cheek comment was merely a 'ha ha, if your boss is Yakuza he wouldn't care ha ha".

[furrykef]

Wow, my posts are finally making it into the annals of history, being remembered simply as "I read once of somebody who..."

Well, I'm never good at remembering who said what (unless it's something a particular person is likely to say... or if somebody disagrees with something I said, there's probably a 50% chance it's Yudan Taiteki ).

I actually thought I read it on a different forum. It could have been an independent occurrence. Or maybe my memory is just fuzzy as a bunny who has been through a trip in the dryer.

EDIT: I did a quick search on a hunch and found where I'd originally read it. It was one of Keaton's posts on the wiki.

- Kef

[two_heads_talking]

I see, since it is used in Yakuza society, it would be quite rude...

That's an interesting conclusion to draw. It's just plain rude, not -because- it's used by Yakuza. The tongue-in-cheek comment was merely a 'ha ha, if your boss is Yakuza he wouldn't care ha ha".

Exactly.. it would be considered less rude in that society, but none-the-less, it's better to not use it than try to figure out when it would appropriate to use it.

[Seiko]

Sumimasen,

I believe the proper way of saying Tony is..

Tony-kun

Kun is usually for boys

San is usually for girls

Just thought I'd let you know, Tony-kun.

Gomen nasai.

Yoi ichinichi o!

[chikara]

.... I believe the proper way of saying Tony is..

Tony-kun

Kun is usually for boys

San is usually for girls

......

冗談ですね。

05 Dec 2008 --------> 27 Sep 2010

[furrykef]

I believe the proper way of saying Tony is..

Tony-kun

Kun is usually for boys

San is usually for girls

"San" is for people you don't necessarily know well, regardless of gender, or somebody to whom you wish to express a certain level of formality/politeness. Tony (assuming we mean AJBryant) definitely seems like a "-san" to me. Most people here are either newbies who don't know Tony well, or they're old regulars who see him as something of a father figure; "-san" works in both cases.

"Kun" is generally applied to boys or men, but "-kun is used with men" does not imply the converse, that you should you should address men as "-kun". (Compare: all cats are animals, but not all animals are cats.)

05 Dec 2008 --------> 27 Sep 2010

This is a sticky thread, so necroposting isn't a concern. Strange that it'd go so long without posts, though.

I think Seiko is referring to Sachi's post from Apr 9, 2006 (since there's no "Tony-san" mentioned on this page of the thread), making it an even later response...

[chikara]

..... or they're old regulars who see him as something of a father figure; "-san" works in both cases. .....

As Tony-san is younger than me I look up to him for his experience and knowledge, not as a father figure.

05 Dec 2008 --------> 27 Sep 2010

This is a sticky thread, so necroposting isn't a concern. Strange that it'd go so long without posts, though.

I think Seiko is referring to Sachi's post from Apr 9, 2006 (since there's no "Tony-san" mentioned on this page of the thread), making it an even later response...

You did better than me as I read back a number of posts but couldn't work out which post Seiko-san was actually responding to. Despite the thread being a sticky in my opinion the post falls into the;

"... unless your post is bringing up important information, or asking for better clarification, then we request you refrain from posting in old threads. .."

category.

So despite being a sticky this thread has been dormant for almost two years because no one has had anything important to add.

[keatonatron]

I'm glad to see I'm still causing a ruckus, even from "beyond the grave".