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can we break this apart

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can we break this apart

Postby squarezebra » Mon 09.21.2009 7:00 am

I'm looking through some of the readings on the EJOD pages, and I came accross this:
たくさんの外国人が知っている日本の食べ物はすしだとおも思いますが日本にはすしよりおいしい食べ物がたくさんあります。

Now, I get the gist of it. Its saying how there is actually a lot more to japanese food than just sushi ... which, lets face it, is the first thing most people would think of when you say "Japanese food". Getting the gist is ok, but I need to understand whats going on.

すしよりおいしい食べ物がたくさんあります: this is fine, and doesn't cause me any problems.

たくさんの外国人が知っている日本の食べ物はすしだとおも思います: this is more difficult. "I know many foreigners who think that sushi is the main (主) japanese food"? I seriously think I should be comfortable with this kind of level by now ... but its irritating the life out of me :(

Any suggestions?
:D
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Re: can we break this apart

Postby astaroth » Mon 09.21.2009 8:31 am

squarezebra wrote:たくさんの外国人が知っている日本の食べ物はすしだとおも思います: this is more difficult. "I know many foreigners who think that sushi is the main (主) japanese food"? I seriously think I should be comfortable with this kind of level by now ... but its irritating the life out of me :(

I think it's more like:
I think that (the only) Japanese food known by many foreigners is sushi.
おも coming after と can't modify 日本の食べ物 so I don't know ... at first I thought it was a typo ...
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Re: can we break this apart

Postby NileCat » Mon 09.21.2009 8:42 am

astaroth wrote:おも coming after と can't modify 日本の食べ物 so I don't know ... at first I thought it was a typo ...

Yes. It's nothing but a typo. :)
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Re: can we break this apart

Postby NocturnalOcean » Mon 09.21.2009 8:46 am

NileCat wrote:
astaroth wrote:おも coming after と can't modify 日本の食べ物 so I don't know ... at first I thought it was a typo ...

Yes. It's nothing but a typo. :)

Probably a tyop, but from google you can see people write something like "とおも(思)" to show kanji for it, so might be to show kanji, and forgotten () or something
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Re: can we break this apart

Postby squarezebra » Wed 09.23.2009 4:18 am

This is great thanks!

I guess I still haven't "quite" got the hang of noun modification yet >.>

I'll get there in the end.
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Re: can we break this apart

Postby NileCat » Wed 09.23.2009 6:01 am

squarezebra wrote:I guess I still haven't "quite" got the hang of noun modification yet >.>

Honestly speaking, I have no idea what "noun modification" means.
But I tried to come up with some possible words that can be placed between "だと" and "思う".

たくさんの外国人が知っている日本の食べ物はすしだと(X)思います。

すしだと思います。---limitation
すしだと思います。---"also" ---It's not necessarily correct in this context. But we sometimes use it without thinking.

すしだとやはり思います。---"after all"
すしだと絶対に思います。---"absolutely"
すしだとまず思います。---"firstly"
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Re: can we break this apart

Postby astaroth » Wed 09.23.2009 8:14 am

squarezebra wrote:I guess I still haven't "quite" got the hang of noun modification yet >.>

I honestly don't see 〜と思う as a noun modification, but rather indirect quote like in English "I think that ..."
Noun modification would be when a noun is modified like the first half of your example
たくさんの外国人が知っている日本の食べ物…
where here the sentence modifies the noun 食べ物 ... I think even 日本の is technically a noun modifier, that is の is the particle used to modify a noun with a noun, but I might be wrong.
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Re: can we break this apart

Postby squarezebra » Wed 09.23.2009 8:20 am

Hi NileCat, i'm not really sure if its the right terminlogy, but by noun modification what i mean is this type of sentence:
The girl who was in a red dress gave me an orange, with "who was in a red dress" clause modifying the noun "girl".

thus:
駅の右立っているの女の子 (the girl standing to the right of the station) where 駅の右立っている modifies 女の子
In principle, I understand these types of sentences. Its just, in practice I often find them confusing. I just need to practice reading more and more until I get the hang of them. I get a little frustrated because i'm too impatient ... I want to understand everthing now...right now! :D

Gee, i'm so glad you people are around to dig me out of these holes :D
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Re: can we break this apart

Postby Yudan Taiteki » Wed 09.23.2009 8:22 am

Small correction; you don't use の there; it's just 立っている女の子.
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Re: can we break this apart

Postby NileCat » Wed 09.23.2009 8:29 am

あ、わかった! 「修辞節」ですね。
Thanks!
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