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"Stop raining" in Japanese

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"Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby meganliu » Tue 12.29.2009 8:42 am

I was wondering which is the correct way to say" Please stop raining". Here I gave two sentences:

雨を止めてください。
雨が止まってください。

But I'm not sure which is the right one or both of them are wrong.
The active and passive verb pairs have been bugging me for a long time and still can not figure out the answer.
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby shin1ro » Tue 12.29.2009 9:58 am

This is correct: 雨を止めてください。

..But I wonder to whom you ask to stop...? :roll:
This sounds asking someone to stop the rain. So I think this sounds better:

雨よ、やんでください。

It sounds like asking to the "rain" itself.

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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby keatonatron » Tue 12.29.2009 11:30 am

Expanding on what sh1nro said, the way to say "the rain stopped" is 「雨がやんだ」, so the command form should be「(雨は)やんでください」.

I could see someone saying in exasperation もう、やんでくださいよ! as they are stuck walking home and the rain simply won't quit :wink:
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby two_heads_talking » Tue 12.29.2009 4:13 pm

keatonatron wrote:Expanding on what sh1nro said, the way to say "the rain stopped" is 「雨がやんだ」, so the command form should be「(雨は)やんでください」.

I could see someone saying in exasperation もう、やんでくださいよ! as they are stuck walking home and the rain simply won't quit :wink:


they'd be so polite if they were exasperated? i'd expect at least nasai or other base command form.
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby chikara » Tue 12.29.2009 7:44 pm

shin1ro wrote:..But I wonder to whom you ask to stop...? :roll: .......

Who'll stop the rain? :)
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby keatonatron » Tue 12.29.2009 8:02 pm

two_heads_talking wrote:they'd be so polite if they were exasperated? i'd expect at least nasai or other base command form.


Depending on how it is said, ください isn't always that polite... :wink:

Plus, if you're speaking to a "higher power", perhaps you should keep it "firm but polite", no? :lol: Be too rude and you might get struck by lightning!
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby shin1ro » Wed 12.30.2009 1:47 am

chikara wrote:
shin1ro wrote:..But I wonder to whom you ask to stop...? :roll: .......

Who'll stop the rain? :)

Wow, I only know an old hit song "I want to know, have you ever seen the rain". I don't know any of the lyrics but they seem to long for stopping probably the heavy and cruel rain in the series of their songs...? (笑)

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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby meganliu » Wed 12.30.2009 2:05 am

Then what's the difference between 止まるand 止む? If I'm correct, both of them are active forms, right? Then this makes clear to distinguish them to 止める.

So can I say 止まるand止む mean exactly the same? For example,
雨が止まるまで待つ。
雨が止むまで待つ。(These two mean the same thing, right?)
雨を止めるまで待つ。( This is wrong, right?)
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby two_heads_talking » Wed 12.30.2009 3:07 pm

keatonatron wrote:
two_heads_talking wrote:they'd be so polite if they were exasperated? i'd expect at least nasai or other base command form.


Depending on how it is said, ください isn't always that polite... :wink:

Plus, if you're speaking to a "higher power", perhaps you should keep it "firm but polite", no? :lol: Be too rude and you might get struck by lightning!


I was considering the 'not to piss off diety' angle, but figured the exasperation would win out. and honestly, while nasai is not considered a more direct 'command' than kudasai, at a point nasaru was the way to refer to those of extremely high positions (at least if I remember my keigo correctly) Over time it has (de-)evolved into what it is today.

Perhaps I've forgotten the finer points of using polite words to insinuate impoliteness. gah, that's what I get for not being in Japan since the 1990's..

thanks for the reminder keat..
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby shin1ro » Wed 12.30.2009 11:51 pm

meganliu wrote:Then what's the difference between 止まるand 止む? If I'm correct, both of them are active forms, right? Then this makes clear to distinguish them to 止める.

Yes, I think 止まる and 止む are active forms (not passive forms) but I think the distinguishing has to be the classification by 自動詞 intransitive verb and 他動詞 transitive verb (object ~を is required).

止まる(とまる) and 止む(やむ normally hiragana) are 自動詞. And 止める is a 他動詞. There's no 他動詞 version of 止む (~を止む) in modern Japanese (やむ was a 他動詞 as well in classic Japanese). Only 止める can be a positive form 止められる because it's a 他動詞. In addition, there's no word やまる(止まる) (maybe seemingly as a 自動詞) in standard Japanese (but probably it is found in some dialects, maybe in Kyushu??).

So can I say 止まるand止む mean exactly the same? For example,
雨が止まるまで待つ。
雨が止むまで待つ。(These two mean the same thing, right?)
雨を止めるまで待つ。( This is wrong, right?)

Yes, 止まる and 止む are the same.
But as for rain, 雨が止まる is just not used in Japanese.
雨を止める(とめる) is possible in grammatical point of view but it sounds like someone can do it.

If it's pronounced 雨を止める(やめる), it's another story. It's grammatically correct but it sounds like 雨 is a kind of habit such as smoking. Or, a kind of god who's in charge of rain decides to stop his work by some reason.

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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby Mike Cash » Thu 12.31.2009 5:53 am

keatonatron wrote:
two_heads_talking wrote:they'd be so polite if they were exasperated? i'd expect at least nasai or other base command form.


Depending on how it is said, ください isn't always that polite... :wink:

Plus, if you're speaking to a "higher power", perhaps you should keep it "firm but polite", no? :lol: Be too rude and you might get struck by lightning!


The ~ますように construction is commonly used when speaking of something meant prayerfully.
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby two_heads_talking » Thu 12.31.2009 12:42 pm

Mike Cash wrote:
keatonatron wrote:
two_heads_talking wrote:they'd be so polite if they were exasperated? i'd expect at least nasai or other base command form.


Depending on how it is said, ください isn't always that polite... :wink:

Plus, if you're speaking to a "higher power", perhaps you should keep it "firm but polite", no? :lol: Be too rude and you might get struck by lightning!


The ~ますように construction is commonly used when speaking of something meant prayerfully.
Ah, yes, how could I have forgotten that? You see that or a similar usage in the scriptures as well. I don't have them in front of me right now, but I'm sure I remember seeing that a few times.
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby Ben Bullock » Fri 01.01.2010 12:20 am

meganliu wrote:I was wondering which is the correct way to say" Please stop raining".

I don't think "Please stop raining" makes sense in English, so it's difficult to translate it. Like translating Harry Potter into Japanese or something.
meganliu wrote:Here I gave two sentences:

雨を止めてください。
雨が止まってください。

But I'm not sure which is the right one or both of them are wrong.

If Japanese people wanted the rain to stop, maybe they would say something like

雨が止んだらうれしい
雨(は)止んでほしい
meganliu wrote:The active and passive verb pairs have been bugging me for a long time and still can not figure out the answer.

I'm not sure what you mean by active and passive verb pairs, maybe transitive and intransitive verbs?
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby mbridge » Fri 01.01.2010 3:30 pm

I don't know if this is the direction you're looking to go into, but I was thinking it's a little weird to talk to a thing that isn't alive, so maybe a phrase like "please stop raining" (which is a mix-up of polite and rude btw, even in English, such as the incorrect fragmented phrase "May I help who's next?") should be considered in a phrase that one would say as a comment to another person, or as a phrase one would utter to oneself, such as

to others (polite): [早く]雨が止んだらいいですね。(It'd be nice if the rain stopped [soon].)
to yourself: 雨は止まらないかな。 (I hope the rain stops falling.)
to yourself: 雨が降らなかったらいいな。 (It would be nice if it wasn't raining.)
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Re: "Stop raining" in Japanese

Postby furrykef » Fri 01.01.2010 4:36 pm

mbridge wrote:such as the incorrect fragmented phrase "May I help who's next?"


I don't see anything incorrect or fragmented about it. Perhaps "May I help the next person?" would be more consistently formal, but I don't think that's a gold standard for correctness.

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