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what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

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what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby Stefan » Thu 02.11.2010 12:51 pm

i know that っていうか is used like saying " it's not that, its just" like in the example:

女・a   或る日, 買い物を行くの?
女・b    うんん。。。
女・a    どうして?お金がないんですか?
女・b    っていうか、ホンマに行ったことはいったんだけど、アタイのお気に入りのドラマをまじまじと見るよ。
(word for word and grammar break-down for those interested
woman a-------- the other day, shopping (obj) to go (sentence ending part.
woman b-------- nooooo うんmeans yea,yes but added nnnnnnn makes it more of a no,nope うんんん
woman a-------- why not? money (sub) not exist (んです explanatory no) (? part) 
woman b-------- its not that, its just, really,truly (more colloq than honto ni used more in kansei area) (A ことはB が/けどC : 1st of all A and B are the same word and the same tense a rough trans is as for the matter of A/B i tried to A/B but like in the above expression 行くor i mean 行った-----i tried to go,but--- basically i acknowledges the validity of what the other party has said, but then goes to explain that there are other factors and variables to consider in woman b's case the soap that was on is one of those factors. this set expression can also be used with adj too---おいしいいことわおいしいけど) atai is just a more causal way of saying atashi , the female counterpart of watashi and uses the same exact kanji as it too,(possessive no) favorite (another possessive no) soap drama,opera (obj) to concentrate on (what you looking at), to seriously watch something, it's just an onomatopoeia plus miru.

woman a: did you go shopping the other day?

woman b: no...

woman a: why not? you have money don't you?

woman b: IT"S NOT THAT, i really tried to go but i was really concentrating on my favorite soap opera, drama.

in any case that's just one the uses i know for -tte iu ka. i think theres more but i needssss some helpssssssss. also i was told that to iu ka had a different meaning altogether. please help. おおおおおおおおおおおおおお お願いします
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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby chikara » Thu 02.11.2010 6:00 pm

Is there really any difference?

According to EDICT;

ってゆうか; っていうか; っつーか; っつうか; つーか; てゆーか; ってか (conj) (See と言うか) (col) or rather (say); or better (say); or perhaps I should say; or, how should I put it,...; I mean

と言うか 【というか】 (exp,adv) (See ってゆうか) or perhaps I should say; or, how should I put it,....
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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby Hyperworm » Thu 02.11.2010 7:09 pm

Hm, that dialogue looks wrong... :|

Issues:
1. ある日 doesn't mean "the other day", it means "One day," (e.g. in stories) or similar.
2. Tenses are weird (行く→行った、見る→見た)
3. うんん means "hmmm". ううん means "no".
4. VたことはVたけど doesn't mean "I tried to V". It means "I did (actually do) V, however (something else went wrong)" ...
5. (Most relevant to the thread) っていうか doesn't mean "it's not that", or at least, I don't think it works in the context in which you've used it.

However, as chikara says, I think っていうか and というか are pretty much interchangeable.

Probably this thread now needs (links to) good explanations or examples of っていうか ... I don't think its use can be grasped very easily from the edict definition. ._.
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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby Stefan » Thu 02.11.2010 10:38 pm

Hyperworm wrote:Hm, that dialogue looks wrong... :|

Issues:
1. ある日 doesn't mean "the other day", it means "One day," (e.g. in stories) or similar.
2. Tenses are weird (行く→行った、見る→見た)
3. うんん means "hmmm". ううん means "no".
4. VたことはVたけど doesn't mean "I tried to V". It means "I did (actually do) V, however (something else went wrong)" ...
5. (Most relevant to the thread) っていうか doesn't mean "it's not that", or at least, I don't think it works in the context in which you've used it.

However, as chikara says, I think っていうか and というか are pretty much interchangeable.

Probably this thread now needs (links to) good explanations or examples of っていうか ... I don't think its use can be grasped very easily from the edict definition. ._.


1 my bad
2 ditto
3 at least now i know
4 you're right
5 according to learn japanese pod-------http://learnjapanesepod.com/78-its-not-like-that/ #78 it means that. maybe i misinterpreted what was said. In any case see i messed up a lot, i appriciate the feedback thank you :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop: :sweatdrop:
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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby Hyperworm » Thu 02.11.2010 11:54 pm

Mmm... I could be wrong about the last one.

Most of the uses of っていうか I can remember seem to be describable by something like "revising what you or someone else has said so as to word it better (making it more correct, or more explicit, or more concise)" rather than a complete contradiction.
The edict definition above backs that up; all the English translations seem to refer to "perhaps it would be better if we put it like this" - a better wording or phrasing for something that isn't totally wrong, just hasn't got the point across quite right.

The examples they give there can be interpreted like that too.
「歌手ですよね?」「っていうか作曲家です」 it would be better to say that I'm a composer (but you had the right idea that I'm involved with music)
「仕事が嫌いでしょう」「っていうか通勤電車が嫌いです」 it would be better to say that I hate commuter trains (but you had the right idea that I don't like coming to work)
「なんで図書館へ行かないの?」「行かないっていうか、今日図書館は休みなんだ」 it would be better to say that the library isn't open today (but you had the right idea that I won't/can't go)

If the profession in the first one had been something totally random and unrelated like "author" or "salesman" I'm not sure っていうか would have worked. Similarly I think 「っていうか結構好きなんです」 would not have worked as a response to the second.

In your example I didn't see any element of "partial correctness" between the guess of "You don't have any money?" and the truth of "I was absorbed in dramas and couldn't tear myself away", so I think っていうか doesn't work.

As I said I could be wrong on this and I'd like someone to confirm or refute it?
I could be reading into it something that isn't there ._.
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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby becki_kanou » Fri 02.12.2010 3:42 am

Another difference is that っていうか (and esp. っていうかさ) can have another meaning of "Anyway, like..." and can sound very slangy and even slightly rude, so is probably best avoided until you can use it with more confidence.

Also you didn't ask about this, but アタイ is another one of those "only in anime" pronouns. It sounds like a female biker or something, and although I've seen it used in manga/anime, I've never heard a real girl use it. Most girls say わたし, あたし or if you're in Kansai うち. Young girls or teens/early twenties trying to be cute will use their own name in place of a pronoun.
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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby tōkai devotee » Fri 02.19.2010 2:40 am

becki_kanou wrote: Young girls or teens/early twenties trying to be cute will use their own name in place of a pronoun.



How is that cute?? I mean, to them it maybe sounds cute, but it seems kind of childish, to me at least. I have heard some teenage girls use this and I've thought they're very immature but trying to act mature or something.
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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby chikara » Fri 02.19.2010 3:05 am

tokai devotee wrote:How is that cute?? I mean, to them it maybe sounds cute, but it seems kind of childish, to me at least. I have heard some teenage girls use this and I've thought they're very immature but trying to act mature or something.

Some people do that in English also and it definitely does not sound cute. The dreaded "third person-ism" :evil:
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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby AJBryant » Fri 02.19.2010 4:41 am

Don't forget, though, that Japanese is not English. Different language, different syntax, different rules.

It used to be quite common (and you get this if you watch a lot of jidai geki) to use your own name instead of a pronoun.
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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby Harisenbon » Fri 02.19.2010 4:43 am

Tokai Devotee and Chikara:
Different Culture, different grammar rules about what is considered cute. :)


On a related note, my Government teacher in high school referred to herself ONLY in third person. It was very bizarre.

"Jameson gonna get you!"
"Jameson saw you gettin shugga outsida Jameson's door!"

The second one was actually directed at me when she caught me snogging my g/f outside her classroom. :/

EDIT: dammit, Tony beat me because I like to put in useless stories. ;)
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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby furrykef » Fri 02.19.2010 6:06 am

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Re: what are the differences between っていうか・というか?

Postby jbourque » Tue 03.02.2010 12:08 pm

Try "in other words" or a play off that phrasing. See if it helps.
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