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「・・・」と言われる and 「・・・」と言う

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「・・・」と言われる and 「・・・」と言う

Postby Mattias » Tue 02.08.2011 6:13 pm

I was wondering what the diffrence between 「・・・」と言われる and 「・・・」と言う is.

The full text I'm looking at is: また、タンパク質が豊富で、「畑の肉」と言われるほど栄養があり、大豆を加工した食品は、日本人の食生活に欠かせないものだ。 and the topic is 大豆 in this case

I can translate that to something like this:
Soybeans are rich in protein and has so much nutrition that you may call it "the meat of the field" and food that has processed soybeans is a necessary part for a Japanese eating habits.

If we take external examples:
現代のおとぎ話と言われる
現代のおとぎ話と言う
Both of these would translate to: be called a modern fairy tale

I just can't see the diffrence in nuance I suppose. If someone would be so kind to clearify this. I think it's hard because it uses the quoting particle と and has no direct object etc. like a regular passive sentence has.
It's easy to understand "クッキーが私に食べられた。" (The cookies were eaten by me.)

Thanks in advance for a good explanation!
Mattias
 
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Joined: Sat 03.07.2009 5:50 am
Native language: Swedish; English

Re: 「・・・」と言われる and 「・・・」と言う

Postby chikara » Tue 02.08.2011 7:54 pm

Mattias wrote:I was wondering what the diffrence between 「・・・」と言われる and 「・・・」と言う is. ......

My understanding is that 「x」と言われる means that something is referred to as x although x is not actually its name while 「x」と言う means that x is its actual name.

In your example;
「大豆」と言う - name is soy bean
「畑の肉」と言われる - referred to/said to be "the meat of the field".

Another example;
「スーパーマン」と言う - name is Superman
「鋼の男」と言われる - referred to as "The Man of Steel"
Don't complain to me that people kick you when you're down. It's your own fault for lying there
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Re: 「・・・」と言われる and 「・・・」と言う

Postby Mattias » Wed 02.09.2011 4:05 am

Thanks! That'll help me translate/read easier for now until I fully understand it deeper.
Mattias
 
Posts: 11
Joined: Sat 03.07.2009 5:50 am
Native language: Swedish; English


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