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imabi web site

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Re: imabi web site

Postby IMABI » Sat 10.01.2011 10:53 pm

Why thank you. If you need any help understanding what I wrote, please feel free to ask. Never skip a lesson, because that tends to bite people in the 尻 later on. I promise you'll have a lot of reading, the site is about 5,000+ pages long 10 font printed out as, probably more realistically 5,100+ pages. lol. One day I'll find out how many pages when I try printing it out, that is once I can afford the paper and ink.

It's always nice to find people that agree with intense curricula. Once, IMABI was like other beginner's sites, but then I thought, it looks too much like everywhere else, there's too much information not covered. Being the perfectionist I am, I've been trying to cover as much as possible. Because, in all honesty, it suggests having to go back on stuff. In school all the day, if they would have only told you something a month ago and everything else would have been so much better. You would be complaining that you had extra stuff to remember, but down the road you understand the significance. That's what I think IMABI is for people, and I hope it'll be that way for you too.

Who knows, it would be interesting if you started a forum here to discuss the curricula. That is if the admins won't mind. :) :whistle:
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Re: imabi web site

Postby squarezebra » Sun 10.02.2011 6:06 am

First off, I'd like to congratulate the work you've done Imabiさん, theres a hell of a lot of info there, it's very thorough, and I'm sure it'll be a fantastic resource for many people. However, if without taking offence you'd allow me to state my opinion:

My take on this IMABI website is that it's way way too complicated for a beginner to make use of, unless they are already thoroughly well versed in how grammar works, and have a large grammar vocabulary. I think most people coming fresh into learning languages who might stumble accross your site are going to be put off. The problem is that there's no learning curve. The example sentences, for example, in the beginner section are not beginner level sentences... some of them are really complicated, and use grammar that you're not likely to come accross until N2 level Japanese. I can understand that you're trying to differentiate it from a whole host of other sites that look the same, but the reason those sites are designed the way they are is because they are trying to be accessible to a larger audience; in parts your site seems complicated solely for the sake of being complicated, and it seems in your quest to be more thorough and 'different' from the crowd has the end result of making things a whole lot more difficult to understand than they need to be.

That aside, as a reference site to dip in and out of, and to supplement your knowledge, or to get a different angle on a particular grammar point, its great. Sure its still complicated in parts, but then Japanese grammar is complicated.
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Re: imabi web site

Postby IMABI » Sun 10.02.2011 7:07 am

Ah, thanks to Hektor pointing out that typo, I myself notice many instances where too advanced stuff about particles is either mentioned but not required of the learner to remember it just yet, or material is not mentioned but referenced to another lesson. I do know some, not all, of the sentences in the first lessons are a bit lengthy and advanced, but the only 'purpose' is to get the grammar point across about the particle. I will try to go back and make them simpler, at least for the first 40 lessons, but this would take a while to implement of course. Thank you for the suggestion though.

Again, these things are all very nice. Time is going to be the major killer. I've been needing to make worksheets for the lessons. This would most definitely ease the pain.

I thought of something just now. The main problem that I'm getting from y'all is that 5-9 are incredibly too in-depth and complicated for the beginner. Well, everything on IMABI is complicated, but at least these lessons in particularly need to have something done to them. I see that not necessarily the grammar points but the syntax are what's causing the main issue. Although in retrospect, I have put disclaimers about how to approach the lessons.

So, I will see how much I can push out into other lessons. Some topics are already redirected to other lessons, and there's certainly some intermediate-advanced lessons that could use more examples from moved material. But, after those first lessons, I say everything else is fair game for me to implement. Now, what I'll try doing for the other beginner particle lessons is try to remove example sentences that have particles that haven't been discussed yet.

But, I was also thinking of something else. I'm starting my Classical Japanese curriculum a little bit differently than my Beginner's IMABI. In Classical, I'm starting off with the verbal classes and auxiliaries before particles, nouns, adverbs, and stuff of that nature past even all of that. So, what if I simply rearrange the lesson order by switching Lessons 10-13 and insert them before Lesson 5. Then I insert a particle lesson after each inflectional part of speech lesson. This would integrate material in and I could structure the lessons to fit the change of order. Again, this would take time, but the result would be
Lesson 1, 2, 3, 4, 10, 11, 12, 13, 5, 14, 6, 15, 7, 16, 8.

Would this help?
Last edited by IMABI on Sun 10.02.2011 8:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: imabi web site

Postby Ranja » Sun 10.02.2011 8:19 am

IMABIさんに、一つお聞きしてもよいですか。

そこにある例文は、すべてIMABIさんが自分で考えられたものなのでしょうか。
それとも、参考文献にあったものを転載されているのでしょうか。
というのも、今は使われていない古い言い回しのものや、少し変だと思われるものがいくつか散見されるからです。単なるtypoかもしれませんが。
たとえば、Lesson 32にある
「本当にあの家に幽霊がある!」
ですが、幽霊には「でる」か「いる」を使うのが普通だと思います。
Last edited by Ranja on Sun 10.02.2011 10:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: imabi web site

Postby IMABI » Sun 10.02.2011 8:48 am

Ah, I know, that is merely a typo. They're everywhere Ranja. The problem is my site builder and drafts. A lot of the times I find and fix them but the draft gets deleted...

I will keep my methods of constructing lessons as clandestine as possible, but I will tell you that most sentences are genuine on my part, but then there are many others where I 'base' it off of an authentic Japanese text of some sort. Often, I read through books and what not and take sentences I think would help demonstrate a grammatical point. I know this is unkempt to say, but sometimes as well, I'm not necessarily trying to make sentences that are practical but sentences that technically work.

Thank you for your input.

Also, I won't be able to fix any errors for a few hours as I need my pc or laptop to make edits to my site.
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Re: imabi web site

Postby IMABI » Thu 10.06.2011 7:35 pm

Ok, I've simplified a lot of stuff from the first few lessons. I'll try to expand this to 1-40, but it'll take a while. In the mean time, y'all can tell me where you'd link things to be instead. I think I've taken 10 pages out in length. So, the difficulty factor should be less than what it was.
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Re: imabi web site

Postby furrykef » Fri 10.07.2011 12:36 am

I find it a bit odd there's a section on the classical language, but not Kansai-ben. I think Kansai-ben is much more essential, because it's ubiquitous. You'll find characters speaking it (albeit in varying degrees of authenticity) on TV, in comic books, in video games... especially in manzai. And of course you will encounter it constantly if you actually go to Kansai. ;) Meanwhile, as far as I know, you'll mostly encounter Classical Japanese in a few proverbs here and there and in little else unless you actively seek it.
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Re: imabi web site

Postby IMABI » Fri 10.07.2011 4:22 pm

'Tis not the purpose for that section furrykef. Classical Japanese is essential to literature, not Modern translations. And, this is the basis for all variants of the Japanese language. It solidifies one's knowledge of modern standard Japanese by seeing how things evolved to that state as well as how other dialects emerged. Besides, Kansai Dialect doesn't exist. Dialects in the Kansai Region exist, and there are many differences between Osaka and Kyoto and even within these metropolitan areas. That, furrykef, if you would please look on the Table of Contents, is information along with the other dialect groups that I have yet to cover.

If I were done with IMABI, there would be a section for it, and I do plan for it to be quite elaborate, but for now it does not and dialects are the last on my list. I think the Classical Language is more important than vernaculars.
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