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Your Method Of Stuydying.

Japanese, general discussion on the language

RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby nef919 » Tue 03.22.2005 12:17 am

I use a combination of things. Pimsleur and the harrassment of the staff at the Japanese bookstore by my house(books-sanseido if I'm not mistake. I believe they also have a website) for conversation practice. I look through allot of the magazines to pick out words I know then try to figure out what its about through context. I use flashcard software for words phrases and the kana. I also have Remembering the Kanji, but have yet to open it, I have too much going on right now. I also have have Japanese for Busy people, but have put it off as I have joined the study group here. Lastly I make stupid flash programs from what I'm studying to really drive it home.
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby mxtheory » Tue 03.22.2005 7:14 am

I started off by learning the kana using the book "Remembering the Kana." It seemed to work pretty well seing as I learned hiragana and katakana in one week each. I'm also studying from the book "Japanese Step by Step" by Gene Nishi which was written to help foreign computer programmers at IBM learn Japanese. Since I am/was a comp. sci major in college, I'm finding this book to be quite helpful. That being said, though that book teaches grammar and vocabulary pretty well, it didn't help me actually *speak* the language. So a couple of weeks ago I broke down and got Pimsleur's Japanese I used off of Amazon and after going through six lessons am finding that it is filling in the "gaps" and actually helping me speak and understand the language.
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby Mukade » Tue 03.22.2005 7:20 am

More a study philosophy, I guess, but:

!!!!!!!!I would STRONGLY recommend ALWAYS studying (any language, not just) Japanese from ENGLISH -> JAPANESE!!!!!!!!!!

I cannot stress this enough. Always go from English to Japanese. For example, when you study your flashcards, ALWAYS look at the English side first, and work your way towards the Japanese. This holds true for vocabulary, grammar, kana, kanji, etc.

I have been studying Japanese for ten years now, and I can tell you that the problems that continue to plague myself (and other learners) is just this: going from English to Japanese. I can listen to very high-level conversations and understand them perfect well. But when it comes time for me to replicate a high-level conversation, I have find myself having difficulty.

Since I cannot say this enough, let me say it again: :)
Seeing and hearing Japanese and recognizing its English meaning is easy. Thinking in English and saying or writing that in Japanese is the hard part.

I've studied Education Theory at the graduate level, and all the methods and pundits agree on this.
I've taught Japanese at the Middle School, High School and College levels, and English at the Middle School and High School levels, and my experience with the students coincides with this.

Please, when you are studying Japanese, do yourself a favor and force yourself to produce the Japanese. It's not enough to look at a kanji and recognize its meaning or reading if you can't write it when you need to, or to hear two people speak eloquently about the intricacies of Japanese art when you can't put in your own two cents worth.

***

Many of you may already have come to this realization, and so I apologize for the rant.

I have just gone through a lot of pain and anguish trying to find the best way to learn this language I enjoy so much. And one (in fact, the main) reason I visit this discussion board is to help people avoid the same headaches that I've had.



Okay. Rant over. You will now be returned to your regularly scheduled programming.
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby toryn » Wed 03.23.2005 11:20 pm

No need to apologise, Mukade.

I'm studing Japanese at school (Continuers and Extension), I'm in my final year, and I totally agree with this. I'm having less and less trouble translating Japanese to English, but when it comes to writing and speaking - especially speaking, my Extension exam today was horrendous - I can't get it out.

It all comes down to practice, just like you said. I'm fairly decent at English, but only because I write and speak a lot - again, especially speak :D.

Reading is a fantastic way to improve your vocabulary and keep your Japanese fresh, but chances are you won't be able to use it to communicate to others in Japanese.

I really needed that rant, Mukade, thanks for jolting me. *scampers off to practice Japanese essays*
Last edited by toryn on Thu 03.24.2005 12:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby white_lily » Thu 03.24.2005 2:15 am

ive just started to learn this language and still havent got any clue at all bout how is the best way to learn this language.
all the thing you guys been said in here make me feel like this language is similar with the complicated cymistry formula wich is one of my most dislike subject.
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby KiyorakaEnma » Thu 03.24.2005 6:22 am

i study at home with one of my japanese friends^^ but the most funniest thing is that im finnish and it is so easy to learn japanese because many words sounds the same.
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby Opgots » Thu 03.24.2005 4:30 pm

I have 2 grammer books and a Jap-Eng;Eng-Jap Pocket Dictionary. How do I study? Well, the 2 grammer books I read the first book within a week of buying it, and the second book within 2 days.

I study just by reviewing those 2 books during my free time. Anything I understand, I understand. I review what I dont understand. Usually, by just re-reading and trying to connect what I can. Using whatever examples or thoughts I can muster I try to apply whatever it is that I dont understand,

As far as writiing goes, I just look over the stuff. I learned my Hirigana from this site. I made sure thanks to that quiz. Ive yet to begin really looking at Kanji in depth. I know some every here and there, the majority yet alludes me. Eh, Ill get there.
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby redfoxer » Thu 03.24.2005 5:08 pm

Daisuke wrote:
I study 1 kanji a day, writing it down alot of times, and i keep repeating the meanings etc.


lol, that means you wont learn 'em all for quiet a few years or so. ^^

Kanji gold is great cos it teaches you the meanings and how they can be used and such with a nice amount of funtions but i think mine is broken since i can only get 1st grade kanji...

also i agree with mukade-sempai becos when i was studying hirigana, i find it easy to recognise the hirigana when i saw it, yet when i would try to write it down, my mind would go blank on certain characters. try and write and compose sentences in nihongo and you'll learn to understand/listen/read just as easy.

also, heres a link (if i may) that may help you in your studies. It makes learning fun...check it out.

http://www.tbns.net/knuckles/index.htm
Last edited by redfoxer on Thu 03.24.2005 5:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby Daisuke » Thu 03.24.2005 5:13 pm

redfoxer wrote:
Daisuke wrote:
I study 1 kanji a day, writing it down alot of times, and i keep repeating the meanings etc.


lol, that means you wont learn 'em all for quiet a few years or so. ^^

Kanji gold is great cos it teaches you the meanings and how they can be used and such with a nice amount of funtions but i think mine is broken since i can only get 1st grade kanji...

also i agree with mukade-sempai becos when i was studying hirigana, i find it easy to recognise the hirigana when i saw it, yet when i would try to write it down, my mind would go blank on certain characters. try and write and compose sentences in nihongo and you'll learn to understand/listen/read just as easy.

also, heres a link (if i may) that may help you in your studies. It makes learning fun...check it out.

http://www.tbns.net/knuckles/index.htm


I don't know whats funny about it... Starting out learning a language is hard, so i start with learning one at a day. I don't know about you but i am sure you got magical powers making you able to learn 20 a day. You are cool.
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby redfoxer » Thu 03.24.2005 5:53 pm

lol, hey i wasnt flaming or questioning your method of learning :P i was just saying what i thought. no need to get all touchy. gomen nasai.
日本語はとても面白いと思いますよ!私は日本語が大好きです!
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby redfoxer » Thu 03.24.2005 5:54 pm

and i do have magical powers. i can turn invisible when no-ones looking ^^
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby Ady001 » Fri 03.25.2005 12:45 am

I often use my ancient (but trusty) Gakken Japanese For Today, published circa 1979. It let me learn Japanese REAL fast. But for begginers, Minna no Nihonggo is OK.

Sure, Pimsleur's OK, but after hearing the Korean lessons, it's TOO SLOW... Better download JPOP or KPOP mp3s and listen to the pronunciation rather than download the way. And also, go to this website. It's the BEST! (thank you CLAY!!!)
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby KRed » Sat 03.26.2005 2:34 pm

I couldn`t agree more with Mukade. Production is the key. Writing and speaking are the most helpful methods of learning, reading and listening are also helpful but production is where the learning really happens.

dekiru dake (as much as possible) is what you should aim for. Keep your motivation high, mess around with the language in order to make yourself remember things, you could make a game eg happy families make some vocab cards and practice do you have a dozen times. Listen to tapes and copy the pronunciation.

Above all else, FIND SOMEONE TO SPEAK JAPANESE TO! I can`t stress this enough.
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RE: Conversing with others in the language

Postby kinch » Sat 03.26.2005 11:17 pm

I've tried this method, one with a native speaker, and again with a fellow learner. While I can't argue that it's probably the best way learn it does offer some hardships.

For example, when conversing with the native, I ran through everything I had learned; genki, interests, hobbies, weather, and so on. Then I ran out of things to say and the conversation stalled. So then we started chatting in english since it seems (to me) that everyone in japan knows english better than I do. The fellow learner was even worse. We both kept trying to make up sentences using english phrases and idioms, and the resulting lines made no sense to anyone. Not even us who had written them.

I would say that the best way to use this practice is after you spend a few weeks (months? years? decades?) getting used to basic grammar, and building your vocabulary. Otherwise you end up saying the same three sentences and never get any further.
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RE: Your Method Of Stuydying.

Postby Ady001 » Sat 03.26.2005 11:18 pm

Another good way to speak and understand Japanese by yourself- watch Fansubs of aniem rather than dubbed because you'll understand Japanese better. Aside fromt that, try to soliloquize...
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