Chapter 3 - Furio Igureshiasu

Questions, discussions and translations on Murakami's Yoru no kumozaru
Post Reply
keith712
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon 02.20.2006 5:19 pm

Chapter 3 - Furio Igureshiasu

Post by keith712 » Thu 05.11.2006 8:48 pm

has anybody figured out what furio igureshiasu means? or is it nonsense!

User avatar
Paul De Stefano
Posts: 47
Joined: Tue 04.11.2006 10:34 pm

RE: Chapter 3

Post by Paul De Stefano » Thu 05.11.2006 8:51 pm

I haven't started the story but my guess is that it is Julio Iglesias the Spanish crooner.
Paul

keith712
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon 02.20.2006 5:19 pm

RE: Chapter 3 - Furio Igureshiasu

Post by keith712 » Thu 05.11.2006 8:56 pm

thanks Paul... I would never have gotten that in a million years!!!

coco
Posts: 3061
Joined: Mon 05.30.2005 12:43 am
Native language: 日本語(Japanese)
Location: 東京都

RE: Chapter 3 - Furio Igureshiasu

Post by coco » Thu 05.11.2006 9:04 pm

yes, as Paul-san says, Julio Iglesias=フリオ・イグレシアス.
in early 80's( around '83-84, I guess)フリオ's sound became popular even in Japan. A famous Japanese pop singer covered his songs.
Last edited by coco on Thu 05.11.2006 9:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Paul De Stefano
Posts: 47
Joined: Tue 04.11.2006 10:34 pm

RE: Julio - First sentence

Post by Paul De Stefano » Sun 05.14.2006 1:36 pm

The syntax of the first sentence has me more intimidated than the ferocious sea turtles. I think that the basic structure revolves around ては. On page 461 of "A Dictionary of Intermediate Japanese Grammar" by Makino and Tsutsui, ては is defined as a conjunction which presents an action/state as a topic about which a negative comment is given.

It occurs in 手だては and 残されては. Is あとでは in the first phrase also a variant of ては? Or is it just the subject of いなかった.

I translate the first sentence like this:

What remains when mosquito incense is taken by deception and even more so when hands defend against bodily attack by loggerhead sea turtles is not one shred of being that is spared.

How close am I? Please help.
Paul

richvh
Posts: 6480
Joined: Thu 09.29.2005 10:35 pm
Contact:

RE: Chapter 3 - Furio Igureshiasu

Post by richvh » Sun 05.14.2006 1:45 pm

The あとでは is 後では.
"After the mosquito incense sticks disappeared, there was nothing left to defend us from the attacks of the sea turtle."
Richard VanHouten
ゆきの物語

keith712
Posts: 29
Joined: Mon 02.20.2006 5:19 pm

RE: Chapter 3 - Furio Igureshiasu

Post by keith712 » Fri 05.19.2006 7:38 pm

Rich, thanks for the help with that first sentence... I was struggling just like Paul... do you think instead of the mosquito incense disappearing it could be that (they) where talked/cajoled out of the mosquito incense?

thanks, Keith

richvh
Posts: 6480
Joined: Thu 09.29.2005 10:35 pm
Contact:

RE: Chapter 3 - Furio Igureshiasu

Post by richvh » Fri 05.19.2006 8:38 pm

I don't think so, since from what comes later, I don't think they were talking to the sea turtle. The verb is defined as "take by stealth", but I just don't know what the author is implying there.
Richard VanHouten
ゆきの物語

User avatar
Paul De Stefano
Posts: 47
Joined: Tue 04.11.2006 10:34 pm

RE: 一体 with negative verb form

Post by Paul De Stefano » Tue 05.23.2006 8:21 pm

I understand that 一体 can be an adverb with the meaning of a superlative such as "What on earth" and "really?" But what does it mean when it is used with the negative verb form 残らず?

The sentence of dialogue is:
でも蚊取線香は一体残らず海亀に盗まれてしまったわ。

Which I translate as:
But the mosquito incense was completely snatched up by the loggerheads and not one piece remains.

Is the 残らず and the しまった somewhat redundant?

Please help.
Paul

coco
Posts: 3061
Joined: Mon 05.30.2005 12:43 am
Native language: 日本語(Japanese)
Location: 東京都

RE: Chapter 3 - Furio Igureshiasu

Post by coco » Tue 05.23.2006 10:15 pm

こんにちは。 Paulさん

「でも香取線香は一本残らず海亀に盗まれてしまったわ」

○一本 いっぽん
×一体 いったい

Now, I bet you can understand without trouble.

User avatar
Paul De Stefano
Posts: 47
Joined: Tue 04.11.2006 10:34 pm

RE: 一体 

Post by Paul De Stefano » Tue 05.23.2006 10:26 pm

Coco-san,

Thank you. As a native English speaker I never think of counters such as ほん. Now I can understand that the incense is stick-shaped, that is, long and thin.
In my childhood, at the New Jersey shore, the mosquito incense was spiral shaped so that one lit the outer circumference and it would continue to burn in ever smaller circles until it reached the stand in the center.

Again, thank you so much.
Paul

User avatar
Paul De Stefano
Posts: 47
Joined: Tue 04.11.2006 10:34 pm

RE: 一本 − いっぽん

Post by Paul De Stefano » Tue 05.23.2006 10:37 pm

As I attempted to type the correct reading into a vocabulary list, I realized that I had misread the kanji from the beginning. I apologize for my mistake. Since one learns from mistakes, I have learned that misreading in Japanese, as in English, often occurs from assumptions of context that are incorrect.

Thank you again.
Paul

coco
Posts: 3061
Joined: Mon 05.30.2005 12:43 am
Native language: 日本語(Japanese)
Location: 東京都

RE: Chapter 3 - Furio Igureshiasu

Post by coco » Wed 05.24.2006 12:27 am

As materials of 蚊取り線香, seeds of pyrethrum were imported in 1886 from USA first time.
I also wonder why we use 本 for 蚊取り線香, because it shaps like this ( I guess it would be same shape as "spiral shaped" .. right? )
http://www.kincho.co.jp/kaisha/japanese ... story.html
But originally, incense have been using for Buddhism ceremonies. Commonly its shapes are suitable to be counted by 本 like a pencil. Actually until 1895, 蚊取り線香 had also straight shapes. So I guess we still use 本 as counter words for 蚊取り線香. (... some may use as counter 個, I think.) 


http://www.ens.ne.jp/~a-in/kigen2.html
here, you can see how tree 木 became 本. 一 is the mark of root of tree.
体 is a simplified of 體. 體 means " many/ plenty 骨 are connected orderly".

As you say, we can learn lot of things even from small mistake. Please do not hesitate asking.
I hope my Engrish doesn't confuse you. :p
Last edited by coco on Wed 05.24.2006 12:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

Post Reply