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confusion

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confusion

Postby Furansujin » Mon 05.22.2006 5:16 am

I just tried to write a dialogue including particules は and の, a -masu form verb and こと が できない. Please, could you check this and correct me?

- 私は日本の天皇目にします。
watashi ha nihon no tennô menishimasu.
I see the emperor of Japan

- 天皇を目にしますことができない。
tennô o menishimasu koto ga dekinai.
I can't see the emperor.

- あの人は天皇です。
Ano jin wa tenno desu.
This person over there is the emperor

- いいえ、そうではありません。かれは天皇ではありません。私の日本語の先生です。
Iie, sô de wa arimasen. Kare wa tennô de wa arimasen. watashi no nihongo no sensei desu!

Is 日本の天皇 correct? As 天皇 means emperor of japan, is this good to precise 日本 ?

Does あの appropriate when it concerns a person, or is there a more polite way to say over there?

Can you say more about そうです ? I saw this in my grammar book but it is not very clear in my mind. I never met it before...

If you see any mistake, please share your knowledge!

Thanks for your usefull help!! This site is actually the best! (And this is the only place where I can find someone to correct me...no japanese speaker around me :( )
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RE: confusion

Postby Machina Maw » Mon 05.22.2006 5:38 am

The first one "私は日本の天皇目にします。" is wrong. I'm sorry, but I have no idea where you got 目にします from O___O. It would be:

天皇に見ます。(I) See/watch the emperor of Japan. (Tennou ni mimasu)
Or, 私は天皇に見ます。I see the Emperor of Japan. (Watashi wa tennou ni mimasu)


Edit: corrected the verbs.
Last edited by Machina Maw on Tue 05.23.2006 6:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: confusion

Postby AJBryant » Mon 05.22.2006 2:22 pm

- 私は日本の天皇目にします。
watashi ha nihon no tennô menishimasu.
I see the emperor of Japan


天応陛下を見ます。
Tennou-heika wo mimasu.

There is no "Nihon no Tennou" as no other country *has* a tennou. All other emperors are Teikou. Secondly, you *need* the honorific with "Emperor." In this case, the honorific is "Heika" which means "His majesty."

- 天皇を目にしますことができない。
tennô o menishimasu koto ga dekinai.
I can't see the emperor.


天皇陛下を見えません。
Tennou-heika wo miemasen.

- あの人は天皇です。
Ano jin wa tenno desu.
This person over there is the emperor


It's not read "jin" -- it's read "hito." And I'd never use "hito" with strangers, especially those with rank. The word would be "kata" -- and again, Tennou-heika.

- いいえ、そうではありません。かれは天皇ではありません。私の日本語の先生です。
Iie, sô de wa arimasen. Kare wa tennô de wa arimasen. watashi no nihongo no sensei desu!


Tennou-heika.
Is 日本の天皇 correct? As 天皇 means emperor of japan, is this good to precise 日本 ?

Does あの appropriate when it concerns a person, or is there a more polite way to say over there?


Of course it's fine. Ano hito, Ano o-mawari-san, ano sensei... Slightly more polite may be "Achira no" but it's relative.

Can you say more about そうです ? I saw this in my grammar book but it is not very clear in my mind. I never met it before...


More about it in what way? There are a dozen uses for that phrase, so I don't know which one is the issue.

Machina Maw:
天皇に見ります


Minor points: The verb miru requires wo, not ni. And it's "mimasu," not "mirimasu." (Verbs are messy sometimes.)

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RE: confusion

Postby PandanoTake » Mon 05.22.2006 2:31 pm

Or, if you want to say like "watching" or "seeing," mitteimasu could work as well.
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RE: confusion

Postby Oracle » Mon 05.22.2006 4:13 pm

Machina Maw wrote:
The first one "私は日本の天皇目にします。" is wrong. I'm sorry, but I have no idea where you got 目にします from O___O. It would be:


Even though it's wrong to use it in this situation, 目にする is actually a valid and common idiom meaning "to see". It pops up a lot in novels and written Japanese.
It also has counterparts like 耳にする =hear 、口にする = taste/eat etc
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RE: Please do not use "emperor" for sample

Postby coco » Mon 05.22.2006 5:10 pm

I do NOT think it is good idea to use 天皇陛下 in sample sentences.
Because we ordinary* use most polite Keigo (honorific) for 天皇陛下, so it would not be common Japanese.
I mean, at least beginner doesn't need to learn such a Keigo.

Thanks.
---
Edit: added this note
* except Kids and dissenters of Emperor's system
Last edited by coco on Mon 05.22.2006 5:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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RE: confusion

Postby AJBryant » Mon 05.22.2006 6:51 pm

To be fair, coco-san, I was really tempted to drop a 「大君を見奉る」or「天皇陛下がいまそがり」, but I thought that might be a little yari-sugi. :)

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RE: confusion

Postby coco » Mon 05.22.2006 8:26 pm

but I thought that might be a little yari-sugi.
Tony-san :D not " a little" rather 充分 yarisugi.

Furansujin -san.
天皇/天皇陛下 doesn't need 日本の.
Because it doesn't represent other person.

You can use 首相(しゅしょう) as 日本の首相, or 総理大臣(そうりだいじん) in your sample sentences. It has higher possibilities that you will have a chance to see 日本の首相 than 天皇陛下. ;)

Check the difference between 会う(あう) and 見る(みる).
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RE: confusion

Postby Furansujin » Tue 05.23.2006 5:49 am

Thanks all, I understand my mistakes and got answers to my questions. I think I progress slowly...thanks to this site. I have to work a lot! (but exams are coming, I haven't got as much time as I wish :( )

And more, you enable me to use my english!! My english teacher would thanks you for that!! :p


Even though it's wrong to use it in this situation, 目にする is actually a valid and common idiom meaning "to see". It pops up a lot in novels and written Japanese.
It also has counterparts like 耳にする =hear 、口にする = taste/eat etc


I found 目にする in a grammar book at university...I looked quickly for "to see" and found 目にする. I'll avoid to use it now and replace with 見る. But when is it used?? Is this a recent evolution of modern japanese??

You can use 首相(しゅしょう) as 日本の首相, or 総理大臣(そうりだいじん) in your sample sentences. It has higher possibilities that you will have a chance to see 日本の首相 than 天皇陛下.


Yes I know, I tried to complicate my sentences and make something less boring, so I think "why don't implacate the tennô??"!! And as it is nearly impossible to see him, it was a great occasion to use the negative...So I learned the right way to talk about it! Thanks for 首相, I think this is a word I'll meet the day i'll be able to read a newspaper!


Without relation to the subject:

A friend asked me how japanese count distances...and I was unable to answer! I suppose it is not the metric system...so they use the anglo-saxon system or an own system?
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RE: confusion

Postby Machina Maw » Tue 05.23.2006 6:55 am

AJBryant wrote:
Machina Maw:
天皇に見ります


Minor points: The verb miru requires wo, not ni. And it's "mimasu," not "mirimasu." (Verbs are messy sometimes.)

Tony


As I turned off the computer last night after posting that, I realised that I had gotten the -masu ending of that verb wrong. I was hoping somebody would correct me before the person who started this thread took my advice. So thankyou! :) *runs to edit post*
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RE: confusion

Postby richvh » Tue 05.23.2006 7:05 am

Furansujin wrote:
A friend asked me how japanese count distances...and I was unable to answer! I suppose it is not the metric system...so they use the anglo-saxon system or an own system?

Nowadays, they use the metric system. They used to have their own, home-grown system of measurements, which I imagine are still used to some extent (such as measuring room size by tatami.)
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RE: confusion

Postby AJBryant » Tue 05.23.2006 11:29 am

As Rich says, area measurements still tend to be traditional (jou, tsubo, etc.) but most things are metric.

You may still encounter some of the old measurements (volume, length, distance, etc.) in literature and some specialty markets.

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RE: confusion

Postby hungryhotei » Tue 05.23.2006 1:44 pm

Those alsways throw me whenever I come across them. I'm there wondering why they are counting the number of villages that they have walked through before I realsize that 里 was リ not さと a few sentences later.

Although I have to say, lots of other counting words confuse me too. Once I thought I was dealing with a strange two headed beast with one head a lion and the other a boar or something. :(
天気がいいから、散歩しましょう。
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