jaa

[Ogawa]

dareka nihongo de hanashi tai?
tokidoki nihongo de hanashinai kara, chotto tsumaranai ne?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
anyone wanna "talk" in Japanese? I know you cant actually talk but you know what i mean. ne?

[lopka]

Oi
watashi wa nihongode hanashitai desu.
demo amari hanashimasen. anata wa?

[Gaijinian]

Ogawa wrote:
dareka nihongo de hanashi tai da no?

"da" no?

[lopka]

"da" is desu.

btw, hi^^

[Ogawa]

da is the informal form of desu. and when you use da. you would use no at the end. no is the informal form of ka. but only used after da. or so I think.
---------------------------------------------------------
nihongo o renshu shiteiru toki nani o suru no. watashi wa nihongo de hanasu koto ga daisuki desu yo.
---------------------------------------
thanks justin.
i heard that it is common for guys to use kai instead of no. the masculine equevulent of no. is this true?

[Justin]

With the ~tai form you used there, for informal situations, you'd be fine with just saying hanashitai, on the more formal side of things you'd want to say hanashitai desu though. Using ~tai + da is a no no.

You'd be fine there if you still want to use 'no' as a question marker by just taking out the 'da'. One other thing with using 'no' like that though is it does carry some feminine feeling to it at times. It's hard to explain, as there are times you'd hear a guy us 'no' as a question maker, but in general it’s more commonly used by women. I guess it's all kind of how you want to sound though, if you're some tough manly man, to me using 'no' just seems a bit off..

[Spaztick]

Actaully, da isn't the informal form of desu. Yea I know that it's practically the same, but the one big nono when using da is you never use da when asking a question w/the ka ending. This is because the main difference between da and desu is that da is a declarative statement, so it's kind of rude (and it makes no sense!) when you are asking a question and declaring something at the same time.

[Harisenbon]

Spaztick,

Yup. When you ask a question using a more casual form, you should use no. na no is also good for use with nouns and na- adj.

When he wrote da-no, I just thought it was really wierd hougen.

日本語が好きだから，いつでもしゃべりたい。けど，まだちょっと未熟だから，ごめんね！

[Gaijinian]

LONG, but WORTH IT!!!

_______
Herisonbon:
庭でお父さんとゴミを燃えたんだ？(by the way, 'nda' being the same "no," but more masculine)?それたんて罪だろ！:o笑
_______

I'll try to explain:

~(na)no desu/da
~(na)n desu/da
~(na) no
All mean the same thing. 'n' being a couropution of 'no.'
(so, obviously, 'no da' is very uncommon outside of test-books and the likes)
What they do is imply more information, or possibly or like 'because'.

For example:
A Japanese looks at you funny becasue your white.
In explaning why your there, ryuu-gaku sei nan desu would be natural.
It means:
(the reason I'm here is) I'm studing abroad.

In a situation like that, ~(na)n desu is the most natural.

I went to Japan.
Sou? Doko ni itta-n desu ka?
Where did you go (I want to know more!)?

Remember not to touch the structue in Japanese.
e.g>>A good reply would be ~ ni itta-n desu.

_____________

To answere the thing about 'da,' it is informal, and for the most part (unless the other person is obviously lower than you), you should use desu. Sort of like using 'kimi"


Jaa min'na san, benkyou ganbatte kudasai!

Hope this helped.

I'm cheating here, these are not my words, but see these:
____
1) の vs なの (Level: intermediate-to-advanced)

の takes な before it, and always before it, in the case of na-adjectives and nouns.

Proper examples:
○　どこに行くんですか？ ← simply の after a verb (nutral)
○　どこに行くのか？ ← simply の after a verb (masculine)
○　どこに行くの？ ← same (feminine)
○　行きたくなかったので… ←　even in past tense, still の after a verb (nutral)
○　行きたいので… ← even conjugated verbs/i adj's, still just の (nutral)

○　嫌（きら）いなのか？ ← なの after a na-adj (masculine)
○　一番（いちばん）好（す）きなのは… ← なの after a na-adj (nutral)
○　いや、先生（せんせい）なんですが… ← なの after a noun (nutral)
○　何（なん）なんだよ… ← なの after a noun (何) (nutral/masculine-ish)

Incorrect examples:
×　　どこに行（い）くなのか？
×　　どこに行くなの？
×　　行きたいなので…
×　　行きたくなかったなので…

×　　嫌いのか？
×　　一番好きのは…
×　　いや、先生ので…
×　　何のか…

Huge, huge, unbelievably common mistake that a native speaker would never make, but a non-native speaker often flubs. Watch your の's versus なの's. They appear in dozens of different parts of speech, not just in sentence-final positions, but as nominalizers, emphatic markers, all sorts of places. However because the meaning of the sentence is still fine, you will probably never be "corrected" on it. You'll just sound like a novice forever.

(Note the one kind of の that doesn't need なの is the "of"/possession particle. 私の猫（ねこ）.)


AND... for DA. (again, I did not write this, and cannot take credit)

2) Unnecessary Copulas (Level: beginner-to-intermediate)

Verbs and i-adjectives do not require copulas. However, i-adjectives can take the formal copula です in order to set politeness level. Otherwise, using any other form of the copula with an i-adjective is incorrect, because the final "i" on the end is standing in for your copula. That's why i-adjectives conjugate on their own.

Correct examples:
○　　私（わたし）は行く ← verb does not take copula
○　　本もう読（よ）んだ ← verb does not take copula
○　　このケーキはうまいよね ← present tense i-adjective does not take copula
○　　ケーキはおいしかったから ← past tense i-adjective does not take copula
○　　ケーキはおいしかったですから　　　← i-adjective can take です to indicate politeness
○　　海（うみ）はきれいだった　　← na-adj needs copula
○　　すごいな　　← i-adj, no copula
○ すごいですね　　← i-adj, taking copula to show politeness
○　　行きたいから　　← conjugated verb does not take copula

Incorrect examples:
×　　私は行くだから　　← verb does not take copula
×　　本もう読んだだから　←　verb does not take copula
×　　このケーキはうまいだね　　←　i-adj does not take copula
×　　ケーキはおいしかっただから　　←　most common mistake, i-adjectives do not need informal copulas
×　　海はきれいから　　← na-adj needs copula
× すごいだね　　← i-adj does not need informal copula
×　　行きたいだから　　← conjugated verb does not need copula

This is not a "little thing." This is a major problem than almost all non-native speakers have. Please watch your copula use and only use them when you need to.

Ummm... Check THIS out:
http://www.animelyrics.com/forum/topic_ ... ?tid=18258

[lomagu]

ばかすげい！:D

[Harisenbon]

Gaijinian wrote:
LONG, but WORTH IT!!!
______
Herisonbon:
庭でお父さんとゴミを燃えたんだ？(by the way, 'nda' being the same "no," but more masculine)?それたんて罪だろ！:o笑
_______

まずは，ヘリ千本じゃない。ハリセンボンと呼んでください。　（＠’−’）ｐ

次，庭で父とゴミを燃えたという文書は二つの意味がある。だから、面白いだと思う。
父を手伝って，ゴミを燃えたの意味もあるし，父とゴミを組み合わせて，燃えたと意味もある。
国語の授業で習いました。

I don't quite understand your example about the couplas. Maybe I'd have a better time if I new what the hell a coupla was.

It's wierd, I can tell what sounds right, and what sounds wrong, but I have no idea WHY... just like english I suppose. :/

[Gaijinian]

A copula is desu/da type thing. Did you read my post? The fact that you put 面白いだと思う makes me wonder... NO DA W/IKEIYOUSHI!!!! (The second "i" covers for the 'da.') Heh...

Anyway, that tid bit about burning your dad and garbage thing is quite intresting!B):D 国語の授業で習ったんだろう？:p kool.
jyana

[Harisenbon]

Ahh. Got it.

My problem used to always be that I would never put the だ　in だと思う. Now I'm overcompensating. Thanks for the help.

さだこが怖いと思う。
さだこが変だと思う。

[Gaijinian]

さだこが怖いと思う。
さだこが変だと思う。

はい、正しいです。

[Harisenbon]

ところで、外人イアンさん、どのぐらい日本語を勉強しましたか？前の日本滞在経験のメッセジーを読で、すごくうまいと思いました。

最近、僕は落ち込んで、あまり上手に書けないから、ごめんね。元気出したら、もっといい日本語の会話をしましょう！